I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis for the year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand people putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder why people give up so early.
I just finished racing in and helping organize the Colorado International Spring Series March 26-April 2 and I won't put the skis away until late May or early June (depending on the snow). To me, spring brings some of the best skiing of the year and I always look forward to it. Crust skiing, the last one or two epic backcountry powder days, classic skiing in the corn in shorts - all of these things are fantastic.
My question is what does it take to introduce people to this and keep people skiing? One of my friends who is an avid Nordic skier tried crust skiing for the first time last week. She was absolutely amazed at how much fun it is "skiing outside of the lines" and was raving about the new experience. I don't understand how it is possible that a serious skier could never have done that before.
The day after the Spring Series ended, the skiing and weather were perfect, but I saw perhaps two people out on the trails.
We're trying to figure out how to lure more people to the Spring Series next year, but I wonder if we're ever going to be able to pull anyone except the diehards. I have put together a few crust skiing adventures in April, but they never draw more than a handful of people.
send us plane tickets. That'd lure me. Michigan to Colorado is a long way. JK
"Comcast" <REMOVETHISnschultz@REMOVETHISnsavage.com> wrote in message news:r5adneUxj5uDOsHfRVn-rQ@comcast.com...> Hi Everyone,>
I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis for the > year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand people > putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder why > people give up so early.>
I just finished racing in and helping organize the Colorado > International Spring Series March 26-April 2 and I won't put the skis away > until late May or early June (depending on the snow). To me, spring > brings some of the best skiing of the year and I always look forward to > it. Crust skiing, the last one or two epic backcountry powder days, > classic skiing in the corn in shorts - all of these things are fantastic.>
My question is what does it take to introduce people to this and keep > people skiing? One of my friends who is an avid Nordic skier tried crust > skiing for the first time last week. She was absolutely amazed at how > much fun it is "skiing outside of the lines" and was raving about the new > experience. I don't understand how it is possible that a serious skier > could never have done that before.>
The day after the Spring Series ended, the skiing and weather were > perfect, but I saw perhaps two people out on the trails.>
We're trying to figure out how to lure more people to the Spring Series > next year, but I wonder if we're ever going to be able to pull anyone > except the diehards. I have put together a few crust skiing adventures in > April, but they never draw more than a handful of people.>
Why do people stop skiing ? Because there's no snow here !
Well to be honest, yesterday I saw a patch of black, salty, gritty ice/snow underneath a neighbour's tree. If I really wanted to, I could get my skis out of the garage and shuffle around on that... Nah, maybe not !
Oh, and you forgot to mention the other "benefits" of spring skiing :
- Getting Klistered... - Wet feet...
Mark
Comcast wrote:> Hi Everyone,>
I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis for the > year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand people > putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder why > people give up so early.>
I just finished racing in and helping organize the Colorado > International Spring Series March 26-April 2 and I won't put the skis away > until late May or early June (depending on the snow). To me, spring brings > some of the best skiing of the year and I always look forward to it. Crust > skiing, the last one or two epic backcountry powder days, classic skiing in > the corn in shorts - all of these things are fantastic.>
My question is what does it take to introduce people to this and keep > people skiing? One of my friends who is an avid Nordic skier tried crust > skiing for the first time last week. She was absolutely amazed at how much > fun it is "skiing outside of the lines" and was raving about the new > experience. I don't understand how it is possible that a serious skier > could never have done that before.>
The day after the Spring Series ended, the skiing and weather were > perfect, but I saw perhaps two people out on the trails.>
We're trying to figure out how to lure more people to the Spring Series > next year, but I wonder if we're ever going to be able to pull anyone except > the diehards. I have put together a few crust skiing adventures in April, > but they never draw more than a handful of people.>
I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis for the > year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand people > putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder why > people give up so early.
Crocuses are in full bloom right now... This is my 1st visit to RSN in 3 weeks... I am in summer mood and have put close to a thousand kms on my bike since the snow disappeared... I love winter, but when it's over, its over...
In article <r5adneUxj5uDOsHfRVn-rQ@comcast.com>, "Comcast" <REMOVETHISnschultz@REMOVETHISnsavage.com> wrote:
Hi Everyone,>
I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis for the > year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand people > putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder why > people give up so early.>
I just finished racing in and helping organize the Colorado > International Spring Series March 26-April 2 and I won't put the skis away > until late May or early June (depending on the snow). To me, spring brings > some of the best skiing of the year and I always look forward to it. Crust > skiing, the last one or two epic backcountry powder days, classic skiing in > the corn in shorts - all of these things are fantastic.>
My question is what does it take to introduce people to this and keep > people skiing? One of my friends who is an avid Nordic skier tried crust > skiing for the first time last week. She was absolutely amazed at how much > fun it is "skiing outside of the lines" and was raving about the new > experience. I don't understand how it is possible that a serious skier > could never have done that before.>
The day after the Spring Series ended, the skiing and weather were > perfect, but I saw perhaps two people out on the trails.>
We're trying to figure out how to lure more people to the Spring Series > next year, but I wonder if we're ever going to be able to pull anyone except > the diehards. I have put together a few crust skiing adventures in April, > but they never draw more than a handful of people.>
Comments? Ideas?
Yes -- ship some of that abundant Colorado snow to muddy New England! I guarantee that you'll have some takers.
"Comcast" <REMOVETHISnschultz@REMOVETHISnsavage.com> wrote in message news:r5adneUxj5uDOsHfRVn-rQ@comcast.com...
We're trying to figure out how to lure more people to the Spring
Series> next year, but I wonder if we're ever going to be able to pull anyone except> the diehards. I have put together a few crust skiing adventures in April,> but they never draw more than a handful of people.
OK, Nathan. If I drop $350 on airfare, will you take me on a Colorado crust skiing adventure? The wife has a conference in Denver over the weekend of May 1, so at least I would have a place to sleep Seriously, where were you when I was asking about places to ski near Denver at the end of April? http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.skiing.nordic/browse_frm/thread/a627e8c0f3f6f9a2/7ce6efb35a06e1b4#7ce6efb35a06e1b4 I'm not going to take my first crust adventure: 1)alone 2)in an unfamiliar place 3)on racing equipment. All the (close to Denver) resorts will be closed by then.
Oh well, Auburn Ski Club is holding a biathlon this weekend and I'll ski the crust around Tahoe Donner XC and Tahoe Nordic resorts (both closed, I believe, but on public land) this weekend and maybe next. Better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick, I hope.
Ditto on the driving.Plus the price of gas. Fitzgerald "sknyski" <sknyski@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1113407146.932822.287610@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...> Yup, driving, driving, driving. A weekend of skiing means 8+ hours in> the car. There's tons of snow in the mnts, but I've been away from> home every weekend since T-day so it's time to hang 'em up. Plus, I've> put 25,000 miles on a Subaru that is less than a year old.......>
Are you from the US or Canada and you're complaining about the price of Gas ?
ROFL...
FITZGERALD wrote:> Ditto on the driving.Plus the price of gas.> Fitzgerald> "sknyski" <sknyski@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1113407146.932822.287610@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...>
Yup, driving, driving, driving. A weekend of skiing means 8+ hours in>>the car. There's tons of snow in the mnts, but I've been away from>>home every weekend since T-day so it's time to hang 'em up. Plus, I've>>put 25,000 miles on a Subaru that is less than a year old.......>>
"Bob" <SkiBoyBob@excite.com> wrote in message news:3c4uo9F6k5lgvU1@individual.net...> "Comcast" <REMOVETHISnschultz@REMOVETHISnsavage.com> wrote in message> news:r5adneUxj5uDOsHfRVn-rQ@comcast.com...
Seriously, where were> you when I was asking about places to ski near Denver at the end of April?
I was helping organize an 8-day race series and trying to race all of the races, too. I barely had time to sleep, let alone check out RSN.
Drop me a line when you come out and we'll head up for an early morning crust ski when you're in town.
Snow, grooming and people motivated by fun ski programs. It sounds so easy to do.... Enjoy the spring.
-Nathan www.nsavage.com "Jim" <jim_xc@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1113411339.257051.40780@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...> Nathan> This is a dificult question and I suspect that the answer is time.>
Many years ago we could not keep people skiing past the Tour of> Anchorage which is in early March. Now with more programs and a> continually improving skiing culture people are into skiing as long as> possible. Not everyone to be sure but lots of skiers.>
Last night we had a skiing session in the mountains above town. It is> hard to guess but the parking lots was nearly full and probably 60% of> them where skiers. Say 75-100 people skiing after work just in the hour> and a half I was there. Some of my other coaches who were up there> during the day said the lot was full of skiers all day.. and this on a> Tuesday. My guess and this is only a guess but based on the number of> cars on the weekend we had over a thousand people of all shapes, sizes> and abilites up there skiing. Not just the hard core racers.>
Comcast wrote:>> Hi Everyone,>>
I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis> for the>> year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand> people>> putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder> why>> people give up so early.>>
I just finished racing in and helping organize the Colorado>> International Spring Series March 26-April 2 and I won't put the skis> away>> until late May or early June (depending on the snow). To me, spring> brings>> some of the best skiing of the year and I always look forward to it.> Crust>> skiing, the last one or two epic backcountry powder days, classic> skiing in>> the corn in shorts - all of these things are fantastic.>>
My question is what does it take to introduce people to this and> keep>> people skiing? One of my friends who is an avid Nordic skier tried> crust>> skiing for the first time last week. She was absolutely amazed at> how much>> fun it is "skiing outside of the lines" and was raving about the new>> experience. I don't understand how it is possible that a serious> skier>> could never have done that before.>>
The day after the Spring Series ended, the skiing and weather> were>> perfect, but I saw perhaps two people out on the trails.>>
We're trying to figure out how to lure more people to the Spring> Series>> next year, but I wonder if we're ever going to be able to pull anyone> except>> the diehards. I have put together a few crust skiing adventures in> April,>> but they never draw more than a handful of people.>>
Booker C . Bense 13 April 2005 22:28:39 [ permanent link ]
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
In article <1113391128.070175.109610@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, wintermutt <sacwmf@gmail.com> wrote:>i only skate ski. i live in sacramento. suggest a place?>
_ I dunno, there's only about 200 miles of mountain terrain that is fairly perfect for skate skiing in your backyard. Start early in the morning, quit by noon.
Yes. "Mark" <mark@nospam.com> wrote in message news:9lc7e.3634$MZ2.661647@news20.bellglobal.com...> Are you from the US or Canada and you're complaining about the price of> Gas ?>
ROFL...>
FITZGERALD wrote:> > Ditto on the driving.Plus the price of gas.> > Fitzgerald> > "sknyski" <sknyski@yahoo.com> wrote in message> > news:1113407146.932822.287610@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...> >
Yup, driving, driving, driving. A weekend of skiing means 8+ hours in> >>the car. There's tons of snow in the mnts, but I've been away from> >>home every weekend since T-day so it's time to hang 'em up. Plus, I've> >>put 25,000 miles on a Subaru that is less than a year old.......> >>
Hank Garretson 14 April 2005 01:17:58 [ permanent link ]
At 04:58 13 04 05, Gene Goldenfeld wrote:
For the Spring Series, I would add that presence of elites in smaller >venues usually scares away most of>the rest of us.
Hmmm! Maybe Gene scares easily.
I love races and series where the elite participate. It is nice to get a reading of one's percent behind the best. The excitement of a top-notch race is fun. And, I have found the elite great to talk to and party with.
(Snowing here as I type. Three more days of groomed skiing, then people will start crust skiing.)
Kenneth Salzberg 14 April 2005 02:10:46 [ permanent link ]
On Wed, 13 Apr 2005, Comcast wrote:
Hi Gene,>
Can you explain "presence of elites in smaller venues usually scares> away most of the rest of us"? I'm not sure what you mean by "smaller> venues".
Nathan: Don't worry about Gene. Many of us really like doing races where the elite race as well. Especially "smaller venues". I love to see really good skiers (if only as they warm up, and for a few seconds at the starts (and, maybe, if the course snakes around or doubles back, going that fast! on the other side). To say to our friends (who know about such things) "I was at [smaller venue] racing agaist [name of hot-shot], and . . ." is great. And then there's Jay T., who seems to be able to get pictures of himself, at races, with every elite racer on the planet. -Ken
*********************************************************** Kenneth Salzberg ksalzberg@hamline.edu Hamline University ksalzber@hamline.edu School of Law (651) 523-2354 1536 Hewitt Ave. Sisu Skier - 50K Club St. Paul, MN 55104 ******************************************************************
Gene Goldenfeld 14 April 2005 04:00:57 [ permanent link ]
Hmmm, like the many at the National Masters this year? You're wave 1 Korte. Gene isn't, nor are the (more or less ) Genes. Oh yeah, I forgot about altitude in my other post. Hank lives at nearly 8000'. The adjustment is not trivial.
Gene
Kenneth Salzberg wrote:>
On Wed, 13 Apr 2005, Comcast wrote:>
Hi Gene,> >
Can you explain "presence of elites in smaller venues usually scares> > away most of the rest of us"? I'm not sure what you mean by "smaller> > venues".>
Nathan:> Don't worry about Gene. Many of us really like doing races where the> elite race as well. Especially "smaller venues". I love to see really> good skiers (if only as they warm up, and for a few seconds at the starts> (and, maybe, if the course snakes around or doubles back, going that fast!> on the other side). To say to our friends (who know about such things) "I> was at [smaller venue] racing agaist [name of hot-shot], and . . ." is> great.> And then there's Jay T., who seems to be able to get pictures of> himself, at races, with every elite racer on the planet.> -Ken>
***********************************************************> Kenneth Salzberg ksalzberg@hamline.edu> Hamline University ksalzber@hamline.edu> School of Law (651) 523-2354> 1536 Hewitt Ave.> Sisu Skier - 50K Club St. Paul, MN 55104> ******************************************************************
Fitzgerald wrote:> Yes.> "Mark" <mark@nospam.com> wrote in message> news:9lc7e.3634$MZ2.661647@news20.bellglobal.com...>
Are you from the US or Canada and you're complaining about the price of>>Gas ?>>
ROFL...>>
FITZGERALD wrote:>>
Ditto on the driving.Plus the price of gas.>>>Fitzgerald>>>"sknyski" <sknyski@yahoo.com> wrote in message>>>news:1113407146.932822.287610@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...>>>
Yup, driving, driving, driving. A weekend of skiing means 8+ hours in>>>>the car. There's tons of snow in the mnts, but I've been away from>>>>home every weekend since T-day so it's time to hang 'em up. Plus, I've>>>>put 25,000 miles on a Subaru that is less than a year old.......>>>>
Sauli Suikkanen 16 April 2005 13:42:36 [ permanent link ]
Comcast wrote:>
Hi Everyone,>
I just saw a whole bunch of threads about putting away the skis for the> year dated March 25 and before. This time of year, I understand people> putting away the skis and pulling out the bikes, but I often wonder why> people give up so early.
Here, in the local area, ice of the Gulf of Finland begings the degrading phase from mid-March on and skiing on the local bay ice starts getting risky. By then, tidal changes bring water on the ice and snow, and skiing gets wet and sticky. And I would not want to use motor vehicle transportation to get to ski tracks. I set the limit at 400 m.
Andrey wrote> $$ for lodging. A full weekend (sat and sun) of> skiing is at least $200.
From reading this newsgroup, you might guess that enjoyable skiing is impossible without hotel rooms and high-flouro waxes.
But in the springtime (at least), things could be different. Here's a San Francisco guy who truly loved spring skiing:
"Leaving the city after work on Friday night and traveling east over one of the trans-Sierra highways usually permits camping at the road head of the chosen tour." -- quote from Hans Joachim Burhenne's book "Sierra Spring Ski-Touring", 1971.
What makes all that "camping" and driving worth it? "the reward of carving turns into the virgin corn snow on the way down", says Burhenne.
"the way down" -- snowboard -- Don't just bring your skating skis only. Also bring your snowboard (or you can rent high-mountain touring skis in Mammoth). If you do the driving, and choose some days that fit my calendar, it would be great to see you out there.
The springtime backcountry snowboarding and backcountry downhill skiing on the Sierra Eastside are often wonderful -- especially this year. Tahoe is just a starting point. You're not a serious spring skier until you've driven down Rt 395 at least as far as Bridgeport. You're not truly serious if you're not doing some of your snowboarding around Bishop.
The joke of California commitment to skiing is that in late April out in the backcountry around Mammoth and Bishop, I've found in lots of my years visiting that I'm more likely to meet somebody from Seattle or Germany than from California. My Seattle friends this April and May are driving south for 16 hours to set up their tents near Bishop. But San Francisco skiers rarely make the drive to the really great spring skiing.
Ideas and images to make the driving worth it: * Paul Richins: 50 classic ski and snowboard summits in California. (Mountaineers, Seattle, 1999). ISBN 0-89886-656-1. * John Moynier: Backcountry Skiing California's High Sierra. (Falcon, Helena MT, new edition 1999). ISBN 1-56044-913-6. (has things for snowboarders as well as skiers).
Ken _________________________________ revyakin@yahoo.com wrote> Yes, yes, yes, driving. I've got 60,000 on my Subie> which is just over 2 years old.>
And $$ for lodging. A full weekend (sat and sun) of skiing is at least> $200. That's $800 per month. That's 1/4 of my salary.
Today I had a pleasant pretty time skating at the "Glass Flow" area at Deadman Summit along Route 395 just north of Mammoth Lakes, California. First did the loop by Obsidian Dome, then the loop that goes by Wilson Butte. I also skated some off the trails, and that was good too.
Deadman Summit is at altitude 2450 m / 8041 ft. Some areas of the world have their late-season skiing places hidden away, but on the Sierra Eastside you just drive along the main highway and look out the window.
What's very special about this Glass Flow area is how gentle is the skiing. The reason for the name is because of the volcanic formations which you can see from the trails -- but the what's special for me to see there is the widely-spaced fir trees and frequent blue skies.
Actually I had first tried the Smokey Bear Flat area, which was already gentle and pretty -- but it's also a popular snowmobiling place, so it was like skiing on choppy waves. Then I got a call from Hank, and he suggested I drive to Deadman Summit, and he was right, and I'm glad and grateful.
Earlier this week I tried Booker's idea of skiing up on Mt Rose. I tried along the highway between Lake Tahoe and Reno, a little south/west from the high point on the road. It looked very inviting, but I was there on the wrong day and time -- too much new snow -- so I skated a little loop and decided to save my strength for another day.
Ken
P.S. Equipment -- Unlike guru-class backcountry skaters such as Mark, I was using my metal-edged Madshus Pellestova skis which are notably heavier than my normal track skating skis. Surprise was that the extra weight didn't bother me -- skating was just as much fun as ever. (Since my number of Sierra skiing days and airline luggage capacity are limited, I err on the side of conservatism, regarding backcountry skating tours that might have icy conditions on steep slopes in the morning.)
Gene Goldenfeld 25 April 2005 19:18:58 [ permanent link ]
Skating Obsidian Dome on metal-edged Madshus Pellestova skis... No wonder you ski from the shoulders -- and think it's ok.
GG
Ken Roberts wrote:>
Today I had a pleasant pretty time skating at the "Glass Flow" area at> Deadman Summit along Route 395 just north of Mammoth Lakes, California.> First did the loop by Obsidian Dome, then the loop that goes by Wilson> Butte. I also skated some off the trails, and that was good too.>
P.S. Equipment -- Unlike guru-class backcountry skaters such as Mark, I was> using my metal-edged Madshus Pellestova skis which are notably heavier than> my normal track skating skis. Surprise was that the extra weight didn't> bother me -- skating was just as much fun as ever. (Since my number of> Sierra skiing days and airline luggage capacity are limited, I err on the> side of conservatism, regarding backcountry skating tours that might have> icy conditions on steep slopes in the morning.)
