PROPS (PICK 6)> -----> 1 Tom Smith (Northampton & Scotland)> 1 Duncan Jones (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 1/3 Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff & Wales)> 3 Julian White (Leicester & England)> 3 Adam Jones (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 3 Phil Vickery (Gloucester & England)
HONOURABLE MENTIONS: Vickery instead of John Hayes, Adam Jones over Matt Stevens, Duncan Jones over Graham Rowntree, and Gethin Jenkins over Reggie Corrigan. Smith & White are shoe-ins.
HOOKERS (PICK 4)> -------> Gordon Bulloch (Glasgow & Scotland)> George Chuter (Leicester & Uncapped)> Mefin Davies (Gloucester & Wales)> Steve Thompson (Northampton & England)
HONS: Chuter in place of Shane Byrne, Mefin Davies instead of Andy Titterell.
LOCKS (PICK 6)> -----> 4 Steve Borthwick (Bath & England)> 4 Brent Cockbain (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 4 Ben Kay (Leicester & England)> 4 Paul O'Connell (Munster & Ireland)> 4 Malcolm O'Kelly (Leinster & Ireland)> 4/6 Jason White (Sale & Scotland)
HONS: Borthwick over Scott Murray, Cockbain over Robert Sidoli or Simon Shaw, White ahead of Trevor Brennan or Donncha O'Callaghan.
BACK ROW (PICK 8)> --------> 6/7/8 Colin Charvis (Newcastle & Wales)> 6/7/8 Richard Hill (Saracens & England)> 7 Johnny O'Connor (Wasps & Ireland)> 7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff & Wales)> 6/8 Simon Taylor (Edinburgh & Scotland)> 6/8 Lawrence Dallaglio (Wasps & England)> 4/6/8 Michael Owen (Newport & Wales)> 4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)
HONS: Hill over Lewis Moody, Charvis instead of Dafydd Jones or Simon Easterby, Dallaglio over Allister Hogg.
SCRUMHALVES (PICK 4)> -----------> Chris Cusiter (Borders & Scotland)> Matt Dawson (Wasps & England)> Dwayne Peel (Llanelli & Wales)> Peter Stringer (Munster & Ireland)
HONS: Dawson over Michael Blair, Stringer instead of Gareth Cooper.
FLYHALVES (PICK 4)> ---------> Andy Goode (Leicester & England)> Stephen Jones (Clermont Auvergne & Wales)> Ronan O'Gara (Munster & Ireland)> Jonny Wilkinson (Newcastle & England)
HONS: Goode over Olly Barkley or David Humphreys.
CENTRES (PICK 5)> -------> 12/15 Gavin Henson (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 12/13 Brian O'Driscoll (Leinster & Ireland)> 13 Gordon D'Arcy (Leinster & Ireland)> 12/13 Tom Shanklin (Cardiff & Wales)> 13 Mike Tindall (Bath & England)
HONS: Tindall over Sonny Parker or Shane Horgan, D'Arcy in place of Jamie Noon, Shanklin over Will Greenwood.
OUTSIDE BACKS (PICK 7)> -------------> 11/14 Sean Lamont (Glasgow & Scotland)> 11/15 Josh Lewsey (Wasps & England)> 15 Kevin Morgan (Newport & Wales)> 14/15 Geordan Murphy (Leicester & Ireland)> 14/15 Jason Robinson (Sale & England)> 12/15 Gareth Thomas (Toulouse & Wales)> 11 Shane Williams (Neath-Swansea & Wales)
HONS: Lamont instead of Denis Hickie, Morgan instead of Chris Paterson, Williams ahead of Mark Cueto.
4 Brent Cockbain (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 4 Ben Kay (Leicester & England)> 4 Paul O'Connell (Munster & Ireland)*> 4 Malcolm O'Kelly (Leinster & Ireland)*> 4 Robert Sidoli (Cardiff & Wales)#> 4/6 Jason White (Sale & Scotland)>
BACK ROW (PICK 8)> --------
6/7/8 Richard Hill (Saracens & England)> 6 Dafydd Jones (Llanelli & Wales)> 4/6/8 Jonathan Thomas (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 6/7 Lewis Moody (Leicester & England)> 7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff & Wales)*> 4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)*> 4/6/8 Michael Owen (Newport & Wales)*> 6/8 Simon Taylor (Edinburgh & Scotland)#>
SCRUMHALVES (PICK 4)> -----------
Gareth Cooper (Newport & Wales)#> Peter Stringer (Munster & Ireland)> Andy Gomarsall (Gloucester & England)> Dwayne Peel (Llanelli & Wales)*
FLYHALVES (PICK 4)> ---------> Olly Barkley (Bath & England)> David Humphreys (Ulster & Ireland)> Stephen Jones (Clermont Auvergne & Wales)*> Ronan O'Gara (Munster & Ireland)
CENTRES (PICK 5)> -------
12/15 Gavin Henson (Neath-Swansea & Wales)*> 12/13 Brian O'Driscoll (Leinster & Ireland)*> 12/13 Tom Shanklin (Cardiff & Wales)> 13 Gordon D'Arcy (Leinster & Ireland)#> 13 Jamie Noon (Newcastle & England)
OUTSIDE BACKS (PICK 7)> -------------
11 Denis Hickie (Leinster & Ireland)*> 11/15 Josh Lewsey (Wasps & England)*> 11/15 Chris Paterson (Edinburgh & Scotland)> 14/15 Jason Robinson (Sale & England)> 11 James Simpson-Daniel (Gloucester & England)> 12/15 Gareth Thomas (Toulouse & Wales)#> 11 Shane Williams (Neath-Swansea & Wales)*
So that starting XV is;
1 Smith 2 Titterell 3 Jenkins 4 O'Kelly 5 O'Connell 6 Corry 7 Williams 8 Owen
9 Peel 10 Jones 11 Williams 12 Henson 13 O'Driscoll 14 Hickie 15 Lewsey
Rep: Vickery, M. Davies, Sidoli, S. Taylor, Cooper, D'Arcy, G. Thomas
LOCKS (PICK 6)>----->4 Steve Borthwick (Bath & England)>4 Nathan Hines (Edinburgh & Scotland)>4 Ben Kay (Leicester & England)>4 Donncha O'Callaghan (Munster & Ireland)>4 Paul O'Connell (Munster & Ireland)>4 Malcolm O'Kelly (Leinster & Ireland)>
BACK ROW (PICK 8)>-------->6/7/8 Richard Hill (Saracens & England)>4/6 Jason White (Sale & Scotland)>6/7 Lewis Moody (Leicester & England)>7 Johnny O'Connor (Wasps & Ireland)>7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff & Wales)>
4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)>4/6/8 Michael Owen (Newport & Wales)>6/8 Simon Taylor (Edinburgh & Scotland)
On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 13:05:42 GMT, Rob Stradling <rob.stradling@-BOING-ntlworld.com> wrote:
I'm afraid it does, but that's fair enough - so does mine!>
As for the "poor tournament" argument, though - well, I'm sorry, but >this is a bit desperate.>
You are entitled think that
Who were the titans vanquished by England in their Grand Slam of 2003? >Who stormed the Twickenham fortress? The French team that couldn't win >in Dublin. The mighty Scots! The fearsome Azzuri! Who awaited them >abroad? Deadly spooners Wales! Oh, and the lethal challenge of Ireland, >finally overcome by a mere 40 points.>
Does anyone question the quality of that English achievement? No, >because to win five tests in six weeks is a rare and special thing. The >quality of the games doesn't enter into it. 2003 was a justly famous >Grand Slam, and so is this one.
I wasn't questioning Wales achievement, although I'm perfectly happy to do so.
All right. Since you NHers insist on beating us in the Super 12 tipping contest, I'll have a go here, despite only seeing two of the 6N games, and given SCW's probable England bias:
PROPS (PICK 6)>----->1 Graham Rowntree (Leicester & England)>1 Tom Smith (Northampton & Scotland)>1/3 Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff & Wales)>3 Adam Jones (Neath-Swansea & Wales)>3 Phil Vickery (Gloucester & England)>3 Julian White (Leicester & England)>
LOCKS (PICK 6)>----->4 Steve Borthwick (Bath & England)>4 Brent Cockbain (Neath-Swansea & Wales)>4 Ben Kay (Leicester & England)>4 Paul O'Connell (Munster & Ireland)>4 Malcolm O'Kelly (Leinster & Ireland)>4 Robert Sidoli (Cardiff & Wales)>
BACK ROW (PICK 8)>-------->6/7/8 Colin Charvis (Newcastle & Wales)>6/7/8 Richard Hill (Saracens & England)>7 Neil Back (Leicester & England)>7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff & Wales)>4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)>6/8 Lawrence Dallaglio (Wasps & England)>4/6/8 Michael Owen (Newport & Wales)>6/8 Simon Taylor (Edinburgh & Scotland)>
CENTRES (PICK 5)>------->12/15 Gavin Henson (Neath-Swansea & Wales)>12/13 Brian O'Driscoll (Leinster & Ireland)>12/13 Tom Shanklin (Cardiff & Wales)>13 Gordon D'Arcy (Leinster & Ireland)>13 Mike Tindall (Bath & England)>
OUTSIDE BACKS (PICK 7)>------------->14 Mark Cueto (Sale & England)>11/15 Josh Lewsey (Wasps & England)>15 Kevin Morgan (Newport & Wales)>11/15 Chris Paterson (Edinburgh & Scotland)>14/15 Jason Robinson (Sale & England)>14/15 Rhys Williams (Cardiff & Wales)>11 Shane Williams (Neath-Swansea & Wales)>
England (18), Wales (14), Ireland (7), Scotland (5).
LOCKS (PICK 6)> -----> 4 Ben Kay (Leicester & England)> 4 Paul O'Connell (Munster & Ireland)> 4 Robert Sidoli (Cardiff & Wales)> 4/6 Trevor Brennan (Toulouse & Ireland)> 4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)> 4/6/8 Ryan Jones (Neath-Swansea & Wales)
BACK ROW (PICK 8)> --------> 6/7/8 Colin Charvis (Newcastle & Wales)> 6/7/8 Richard Hill (Saracens & England)> 4/6/8 Jonathan Thomas (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 4/6 Jason White (Sale & Scotland)
6/7 Lewis Moody (Leicester & England)> 7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff & Wales)
4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)> 4/6/8 Michael Owen (Newport & Wales)
SCRUMHALVES (PICK 4)> -----------> Gareth Cooper (Newport & Wales)> Chris Cusiter (Borders & Scotland)> Dwayne Peel (Llanelli & Wales)> Peter Stringer (Munster & Ireland)>
FLYHALVES (PICK 4)> ---------> David Humphreys (Ulster & Ireland)> Stephen Jones (Clermont Auvergne & Wales)> Ronan O'Gara (Munster & Ireland)> Jonny Wilkinson (Newcastle & England)>
CENTRES (PICK 5)> -------> 12 Will Greenwood (Harlequins & England)> 12/15 Gavin Henson (Neath-Swansea & Wales)> 12/13 Brian O'Driscoll (Leinster & Ireland)> 12/13 Tom Shanklin (Cardiff & Wales)> 13 Gordon D'Arcy (Leinster & Ireland)
OUTSIDE BACKS (PICK 7)> -------------> 11/15 Josh Lewsey (Wasps & England)> 15 Kevin Morgan (Newport & Wales)> 14/15 Geordan Murphy (Leicester & Ireland)> 11/15 Chris Paterson (Edinburgh & Scotland)> 14/15 Jason Robinson (Sale & England)> 12/15 Gareth Thomas (Toulouse & Wales)> 11 Shane Williams (Neath-Swansea & Wales)
On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 12:10:13 GMT, "Martyn Winters" <zebedee.groundstaff@ntlworld.com> wrote:
I've chosen to pick those I think SHOULD be in the squad, rather than those >I think WILL make the squad.
Wise man. Trying to second guess Woodward is hard enough when he's only got one nationality to select from.
PROPS (PICK 6)>> -----
1 Marcus Horan (Munster & Ireland)>> 1/3 Reggie Corrigan (Leinster & Ireland)>> 1/3 Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff & Wales)>> 3 John Hayes (Munster & Ireland)>> 3 Phil Vickery (Gloucester & England)>> 3 Julian White (Leicester & England)
Of the Leicester props, I'd go for Rowntree ahead of White. White just doesn't do enough around the field for me. Smith has to have an excellent chance given the need for some Scots for a representative party.
1 Tom Smith 1/3 Gethin Jenkins 3 Vickery (if he can improve fitness)
The rest to wait until after the HC quarterfinals.
A possibility of Chuter being an uncapped surprise. Titterrell is less experienced and still an unknown in big games.
LOCKS (PICK 6)>> ----->> 4 Ben Kay (Leicester & England)>> 4 Paul O'Connell (Munster & Ireland)>> 4 Robert Sidoli (Cardiff & Wales)>> 4/6 Trevor Brennan (Toulouse & Ireland)>> 4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)>> 4/6/8 Ryan Jones (Neath-Swansea & Wales)
Hard to leave out O'Kelly. Corry might do a job with injuries, but he's very much a backrower. It's a shame for Ireland they can't get three locks on the field, as O'Callaghan has looked the business when I've seen him this season - he even had a good game in the North v South fixture.
O'Connell O'Callaghan O'Kelly Sidoli Borthwick Kay
BACK ROW (PICK 8)>> -------->> 6/7/8 Colin Charvis (Newcastle & Wales)>> 6/7/8 Richard Hill (Saracens & England)>> 4/6/8 Jonathan Thomas (Neath-Swansea & Wales)>> 4/6 Jason White (Sale & Scotland)>
6/7 Lewis Moody (Leicester & England)>> 7 Martyn Williams (Cardiff & Wales)>
4/6/8 Martin Corry (Leicester & England)>> 4/6/8 Michael Owen (Newport & Wales)
O'Connor Martyn Williams (though I'm not sure he'd cope too well in tests) Ryan Jones/ Jon Thomas -- those know them best can decide! Moody White Corry Taylor Owen
My test backrow would be 6 Corry, 7 O'Connor and whoever's looking best out of Owen and Taylor at 8. Owen has the edge because of fitness and the likely 9. Moody on the bench.
SCRUMHALVES (PICK 4)>> ----------->> Gareth Cooper (Newport & Wales)>> Chris Cusiter (Borders & Scotland)>> Dwayne Peel (Llanelli & Wales)>> Peter Stringer (Munster & Ireland)
Absolutely.
FLYHALVES (PICK 4)>> --------->> David Humphreys (Ulster & Ireland)>> Stephen Jones (Clermont Auvergne & Wales)>> Ronan O'Gara (Munster & Ireland)>> Jonny Wilkinson (Newcastle & England)
This really is a problem position unless Jones can continue his improvement and not get crocked in France. Interesting that Wilkinson may yet play at the weekend, and has been pencilled in for the Lions v Argentina. A big gamble to select him, though.
CENTRES (PICK 5)>> ------->> 12 Will Greenwood (Harlequins & England)>> 12/15 Gavin Henson (Neath-Swansea & Wales)>> 12/13 Brian O'Driscoll (Leinster & Ireland)>> 12/13 Tom Shanklin (Cardiff & Wales)>> 13 Gordon D'Arcy (Leinster & Ireland)
O'Driscoll and D'Arcy are easy. I hope they are both fit. Henson has to be on the bench at least. Shanklin looks as likely as anyone at OC I guess, but Greenwood is far too big a gamble for me. The big worry is IC, where Henson isn't creative enough. Woodward will love his boot, though. I'd go with O'Driscoll there whether D'Arcy is fit enough or not. There's a spot up for grabs, and Smith is the most creative candidate even if he's not got much international game time.
OUTSIDE BACKS (PICK 7)>> ------------->> 11/15 Josh Lewsey (Wasps & England)>> 15 Kevin Morgan (Newport & Wales)>> 14/15 Geordan Murphy (Leicester & Ireland)>> 11/15 Chris Paterson (Edinburgh & Scotland)>> 14/15 Jason Robinson (Sale & England)>> 12/15 Gareth Thomas (Toulouse & Wales)>> 11 Shane Williams (Neath-Swansea & Wales)
Maybe too many full backs for me, and only one out-and-out wing (assuming Woodward considers Robinson at 15). I expect one of Morgan and Murphy will be injured by the time the party leaves, though. Then there is the compromising photo Balshaw has...
