As the creator of Purple Phaze, a geared 36" uni, I wanted to demonstrate it's capabilities. So today, at age 46 and a rider of 15 months, I went out to the Marymoor Velodrome in my home town of Redmond, WA, and rode 14.278 miles (22.978 km) in one hour. This was on Purple Phaze with a gear ratio of 1.89. The attempt was witnessed by licensed officials of the UCI, and the USCF, as well as a few friends. It will be submitted to Guinness for offcial status (as they are the only ones who recognize the hour and the 24 hour records). I was averaging just over 15mph, when very near the end I had a severe UPD due to fatigue. It took me many attempts to re-mount and finish. I had been turning laps at under a minute, but that last lap was 3:40 due to the fall, and so diminished my final distance. Nevertheless, I broke the existing hour record of Stefan Gauler, set in 2000, of 13.231 miles. By doing this, I urge and encourage others to make an attempt to push this record further up where it really ought to be.
I wish to thank my wife, Suzanne Ross, my machinist, Aaron Anderson (who also worked on Sem's world's tallest uni), and the entire Seattle gang who inspired me to be the best rider I can be!!
Congratulations on the world record. Everything FAST comes out of Seattle. When will the rest of the world catch up? Thanks for letting me break it once, too.
Tomblackwood 27 February 2005 06:08:50 [ permanent link ]
David_Stone wrote:> *It looks like you have a small chain running to a tiny axle just> below the regular spot for the Coker's axle. Or is that just my> imagination?*
Here is a link to a close-up of the gearing system.
Tomblackwood 27 February 2005 09:09:39 [ permanent link ]
unisk8r wrote:> *Staying on the soapbox here, I also believe that the IUF ought to get> their act together and keep all reasonable unicycling records, not> just the sprints, but the 10K, the hour, the 100 mile, and the 12 and> 24 hour records. Then (and only then) can a governing body impose> whatever restrictions they want (Guinness is not, and should not be,> our governing body). *
I'd agree. This same debate was had some years ago in the juggling community. There was frustration that Guinness decisions around what categories would be published for world records was haphazard, and generally very narrow compared to the progress being made in the sport (i.e. Guinness would only be interested in most objects juggled, versus looking at things like total number of catches with varying numbers of objects. On the flip side, the IJA (Juggling's equivalent of IUF) did not have any formal system established for establishing records. Finally, a small group of very serious (and respected) jugglers established a governing committee, categories for records, criteria to document/establish a record attempt, etc.
With the growth in unicycling and the advances being made not just in speed and distance but also jumping and droping height, etc., maybe it's time to look the same direction, either within the confines of the IUF, or outside it if that org isn't willing to step up.
Final comment: as a witness to Pete's record today, I would say that while the geared unicycle was definitely part of the equation, the record was absolutely a combination of both the person and the technology. That unicycle is VERY difficult to ride, and he kept an amazing pace with no breaks, no water, no crotch rest, no nothing for an hour. And maybe most amazingly, no falls until after he was well past the record distance.
John_childs 27 February 2005 10:25:51 [ permanent link ]
David_Stone wrote:> * Bottom line: Accrediting does not make the achievement any 'better.'> I don't think we need to be talking about this as a 'record' just> because it's going to be submitted to Guiness! It was a nice> achievement that demonstrated an even nicer one (namely, the speed and> potential of this beautifully engineered machine). *
Pete didn't make the record up and he wasn't first to set the record. It is an existing Guinness record set by Stefan Gauler. Lars also wasn't first to set the 24 hour record. The 24 hour record was also an existing record last set by Stefan Gauler. Here's a link to Stefan's web pages about his records: 'Meine Einradweltrekorde' (http://tinyurl.com/6mkw3). Both Pete and Lars were beating existing records.
The old 1 hour mark was 21,290 meters (13.229 miles). That was a very beatable mark and should be beaten. Those who think they can beat Pete's mark should step up and do it.
Right now the 1 hour mark is a bit out of sync because the pace set on the 100 mile record (6 hours 44 minutes) is an average of 14.85 miles/hour, which is faster than the current 1 hour record. But yeah, those who think they can beat the record should do so. That's how we find out what the fast times should be. Otherwise we'd just sit around a table and try to agree on what the fastest time for a 1 hour time trial should be.
In article <unisk8r.1l2yhm@NoEmail.Message.Poster.at.Unicyclist.com>, "unisk8r" <unisk8r@NoEmail.Message.Poster.at.Unicyclist.com> wrote:
As the creator of Purple Phaze, a geared 36" uni, I wanted to> demonstrate it's capabilities. So today, at age 46 and a rider of 15> months, [...]
As a rider of six months and 45 years, i must say you are truly inspirational. Seriously -- I have pictures from Florian's Red Square visit of you, Greg and Florian posted in my office.
I hope to be as accomplished when i'm as old as you!
HardcoreCokerRider wrote:> * most people don't have the expertise to build such a machine... I> think it is rather unrealistic that too many people will have access> to the equipment necessary to pose much of a threat! Perhaps when> production 36" geared uni's become available on the market others will> be able to attempt to break the record.... until then, the chances> seem rather slim! *
What do you mean? David Stone just said that at least five other unicyclists have done 16 miles in an hour already on standard non-geared Cokers!
Congradulations! What a stunning job. Purple Phase must be inordinately difficult to ride.
I have two comments. 1. Guinness Records and paper work are irritating BUT it is designed to be as fair as possible, so for the next contender, where ever the location, there are at least some standard guidelines to follow. I've dealt with Guinness Records for Solar Car racing (http://www.midsun.uwaterloo.ca/tour). The paper work is time consuming, currently ongoing, but a necessary element in order for any governing body to assume some form of consistency. The Solar Car competitions also have an active governing body to help insure consistency. Its rules and regulations are what Guinness Records chooses to follow.
2. The IUF does need to come to terms with geared and non-geared unicycles. For geared unicycles it looks like only a small number of people will be able to afford them; whether they build prototypes or purchase soon to be available models. Acquiring standard unicycles is far easier and cheaper, thus more accessible for everyone.
It really comes down to what’s desired. Pushing the sport with gears is a great idea. Progress, Advancement, Technology, Human Achievement, you name it, there are lots of great reasons, but I would hate for those reasons to come at too high a cost where the average rider can never compete because the records are financially inaccessible.
Thanks all very much for your support & encouragement!
But I must "say my peace" to counter Stone's stance. I said in my first post that all I wanted to do was encourage others to try this. Whatever the official record is, that's what it is. I've acknowledged that I'm not the best rider in the world. But to say that mine should not be the record just because there are better riders in the world defeats the whole notion of an official record. Take the bike world for example. The hour record is revered despite there being "better" riders than the record holders (eg Lance is arguably a better cyclist than Chris Boardman). But if those arguably better riders never make an official record, then it stands as is. You can argue all day long that Chris' record shouldn't count because Lance did a point-to-point time trial faster. But Chris did it under the then-prescribed standards. That's how records work. Not by arguing about it informally. Technology is certainly an issue in all this. But for us unicyclers, why should a world record not be open to all wheels? Yes, we should have certain standards for comparison. But not little things like crank length. I understand that access to geared wheels is currently limited. But that will change, and quickly.
Tom pointed out the progress made by the juggling world in regulating their records. I too want to see that for us. So, the bottom line is a call to action for the IUF to develop regulations that reflect the modern day racing world. For now, though, I will submit my record and we'll see what Guinness says, OK?
HardcoreCokerRider wrote:> *First and foremost, Pete’s imagination to conceive of his “jackshaft”> geared design and how to build it (somewhat) cost effectively… and his> technical/engineering abilities to bring the design to fruition are> extremely impressive. * lets see if i get my head cut off again. :rolleyes:
Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast. --------------------------------------------------- -forget_your_life- -------------------------------------- -------*muni militia *------- *one wheeled death squad* ------------------------------------------------------------------------ jagur's Profile: http://www.unicyclist.com/profile/502 View this thread: http://www.unicyclist.com/thread/38555
How does distance work on a velodrome? Is the inner painted line the official distance? Do you have to be *outside* this line (which means being on the banked portion of the track)?
Do hour records have do be done on a velodrome track?
Jagur, you are correct! Tommi Miller gave me a video of the history of cycling, which had a brief image of that exact cycle. I was mesmerized...it was so simple in concept and appeared to hold the key to external gearing. But, it had chains on both sides of the wheel, which I realized caused binding issues with the chains. I believe some folks have discovered this same phenomenon trying dual-chained giraffes. It somehow doesn't work as smoothly as you'd think. So I decided to combine both sides into one by using the jackshaft. The cycle pictured really doesn't have a jackshaft, it uses twin direct-drive systems which is different. Another issue was the pedal axis. The IUF has a rule that says the pedal axis must be the same as the wheel. So I incorporated that concept into my design. Plus it solved the practical problem of making the crank attachments shown below the wheel axle sturdy enough. Recall too the guy that made the over-the-wheel jackshaft (pic is on John Foss' site). That was good in principle, but was far too complicated for a simple power transmission. So yes, I borrowed alot of different ideas, but I feel that mine is unique enough that if I wanted to patent it, I could have. But all that matters is that it is capable of being manufactured, which may be sooner than we think...
gbarnes wrote:> *How does distance work on a velodrome? Is the inner painted line the> official distance? Do you have to be *outside* this line (which means> being on the banked portion of the track)?> Do hour records have do be done on a velodrome track? *
To the best of my information, according to Guinness, official hour records have to be done on either a closed course, or an out & back course. A velodrome is not necessary. But the logistics of using an out & back course are alot more difficult to prove & document to the decimal distance. On the track, I had the officials measure the inside edge of the apron surface 3 times, and take the average. It was not possible for me to have even ridden this line, as it was defined by a grass-to-pavement edge. So yes, I was quite a bit outside that measured line on the turns, being in the center of the apron width. To use the banking on that track, you'd have to go at least 20.
HardcoreCokerRider 28 February 2005 10:02:48 [ permanent link ]
unisk8r wrote:> *So yes, I borrowed alot of different ideas, but I feel that mine is> unique enough that if I wanted to patent it, I could have. But all> that matters is that it is capable of being manufactured, which may be> sooner than we think... *
While other designs obviously inspired you... your design seems quite unique and ingenious... and most importantly, you have gone about designing and building the 21st implementation of this type of technology on the latest, greatest unicycle (for speed)... and have tested and proven the design!
Hey, Pete... this is your second reference to this technology being manufactured ... a change of heart or some new developments, perhaps? Either way... that's GREAT NEWS for unicyclists worldwide! I can't wait to hear more...
Your doing an amazing job - keep up the good work! You are a major asset to the unicycling community!
unisk8r wrote:> *Technology is certainly an issue in all this. But for us unicyclers,> why should a world record not be open to all wheels? Yes, we should> have certain standards for comparison. But not little things like> crank length. I understand that access to geared wheels is currently> limited. But that will change, and quickly.> *
Crank length does seem a bit weird.
But allowing geared unicycles to set records seems pretty silly, given the massive speed advantage they have over normal unicycles. Would you allow freewheeling geared unicycles to do the record, which might make a big difference on an up then downhill out and back course, with the higher maximum speed on the downhill and the large range of possible gears.
Maybe there's really scope for two categories, similar to the difference between 'cycling' and 'human powered vehicle' records on two wheels, where cycling is a bike that looks like a normal bike and can be pedalled off from a standing start etc, whereas human powered vehicles are just anything that can be pedalled. Even if access to geared wheels is less limited, it's still putting an extra price premium on specialized equipment for anyone who wants to challenge it, whereas currently you could just buy a stock coker and challenge pretty much any of the records by training up, so they're truly records of athleticism and skill, rather than of technology purchasing ability.
Having said that, it is really great that you've made a unicycle that a relatively inexperienced rider can ride almost as fast as some of the top high speed riders and it'll be cool to see what happens with it.
A split of two classifications of unicycles is going to be the best way to go. With a geared and non geared standard, those who have geared access can continue to push the technology further. Perhaps there are only a small number of events that are recognized, or even achieved: furthest distance and fastest time in one hour or in 24 hours.
Guinness Records will be most interested in what sells; that's their point, to sell books and show amusing humans on TV. For them it is in their best interest to have faster unicycles, geared or not.
World records come with one other price tag: Determination. Funding, ability and practicality all become details to a passionate person who has a dream to push the boundary of human achievement further.
Wow. All this discussion is great! I guess the way to settle things is for everyone to submit their opinions to the IUF. The IUF web site was just modified to allow comments on the upcoming 2006 rules for use in the Switzerland UNICON. Good timing, as by then the geared wheel access issue will be all but gone. If we want to control our own destiny, just like the jugglers, then it's up to the IUF to adopt new rules and recognize the new wheel sizes and configurations.
Vivalargo: I know it's nothing personal and I don't take it that way, but I'd say I was in pretty darn good shape, far beyond "average". I don't think you really have to worry about someone in "average" shape getting a world record in an exertion category!
Just a general comment: technical innovation and sophistication (not the same thing) are essential parts of any bicyclist's attempt to compete today, let alone go for records. These include use of exotic materials and designs, computer modeling, wind tunnel tests, sophisticated clothing and food, dedicated sports medicine, specialized training machines, multi-location training schedules, multi-person support teams, sponsorship by many companies, and the list goes on.
Saying that a record isn't meaningful if a person can't compete on an off-the-shelf single-speed Schwinn bicycle from Wal-Mart is not really relevant.
I don't mean to say that a category of competition where the unicycle parameters are fixed or limited is not valid. It is valid, just different.
This is similar to sailing, where "single class" races essentially force all competitors to use the same boat setup. The emphasis is on sailing skill, some rigging changes, and race tactics. Yet, the solo around-the-world races and records continue to push the state-of-the-art of sailing technology, computer and communications technology, remote medicine, solo sailing techniques, boat design, and the like.
My comment about fitness was directed not to you, rather to this post:
"Even if access to geared wheels is less limited, it's still putting an extra price premium on specialized equipment for anyone who wants to challenge it, whereas currently you could just buy a stock coker and challenge pretty much any of the records by training up, so they're truly records of athleticism and skill, rather than of technology purchasing ability."
I'm stoked that you went out and got after that record. Perhaps more important, in the long run, than your actual performance, is the fact that you were the first person to go after any record on a geared uni, thus establishing the "unlimited" catagory. And for speed records, make no mistake about it: while folks are peddling themselves stupid on fixed axel rigs (no harm in that), the adventure will be happening in the fast lane, where the geared unis are smoking along at 25+ MPH.
HardcoreCokerRider 2 March 2005 05:08:15 [ permanent link ]
john_childs wrote:> *Nothing wrong with giraffes regarding speed records. I just think a> giraffe would be a different category than the standard style unicycle> where the cranks are in line with the center of the wheel.*
I agree 100%... thanks for clarifying that.> -Originally posted by john_childs-> If there are going to be two unicycle classes then the classes should> be standard unicycles (including the designs like the Schlumpf hub and> Pete's jack shaft drive) and giraffes. And that's currently the way> Guinness considers things.[/B]
Why limit it to just two classes? I think there should be separate classes for non-geared, geared, and giraffe... so you would essentially have: non-geared standard, geared standard, non-geared giraffe, and geared giraffe. Of couse what about wheel sizes... I suppose you could also have separate classes for each different wheel size!> -Originally posted by john_childs-*> Stefan Gauler set an hour mark for a giraffe. The info on the record> is on his records web page: 'Meine Einradweltrekorde'> (http://tinyurl.com/6mkw3). *
Wow... that's really cool! I assume they use comas instead of decimal points in Germany and his average speed was 16.048 KPH, not 16,000 KPH ! That's just a tad under 10 MPH -pretty darn good for a giraffe!
I think I can do better, however, with the technological advantage of my geared giraffe!
Therefore... drawing inspiration from Pete, I will attempt to break Stefan's record on my geared giraffe at the velodrome in Queens, NY. I will start training ASAP!
Thanks, John... without your bringing this to my attention, I would never have thought to attempt to break such a record... I didn't even know such a record even existed!
It will be pretty simple (and relatively inexpensive ) for someone else to challenge my record (assuming I am successful at breaking Stefan's record, that is - which is far from a sure thing) because you can gear up a giraffe pretty easily.
Falling off and freemounting (especially when I'm tired) could really eat away at my speed... so I'll have to try real hard not to fall off. Am I even allowed to fall off?
Denali wrote:> *I say 4...> Unlimited/Geared> Coker> 24"/150mm> Giraffe(Maybe this can be under the unlimited category)>
It would be quite messy to have more categories where we'll have guys> setting hour records on 20",22",24"etc... *
That four class division is also quite messy.
The more classes there are the more thinned out the attempts will be for each class. Limiting wheel sizes for individual speed records is not a good idea. For group races on a track (like we do at conventions) the wheel size restrictions make some sense because it would be really messy to have 8 people on Cokers trying to ride around a running track at full speed while trying to stay within their lane. It would be a mess and dangerous. For individual time trial events that is not an issue and I see no reason to have wheel size be a factor in dividing up any classes.
But that's also why the IUF should regulate these record attempts so they can set sensible and consistent rules. Otherwise Guinness is going to be setting rules that might not make sense to unicycles.
joemarshall wrote:> *If you don't outlaw them in record attempts, you end up with a> situation where someone relatively unfit can get a record, which other> riders without access to the technology can't, like the bicycle 'human> powered vehicle' records, where only people with expensive custom> designs can compete and it's arguably much more about the technology> than skill.* [Joe, i'm not picking on u!! ]
i understand that argument in the 'human powered vehicle' classes where u get in/on, lie back and pedal like hell i do think we need to factor in the additional level of difficulty that riding on one wheel introduces to this discussion the geared up uni does allow for greater speed, but it is at a cost the rider needs to be 'more skillfull' to maintain record speeds on such a machine as opposed to a 'standard' uni
your thoughts?
BTW, how do we get some kind of feedback from office bearers of the unicycling organisations on this issue?
GizmoDuck wrote:> *My personal preference would be for a 2 class category- fixed and> geared; regulated by the IUF. Guinness can use the geared category> (or whichever is fastest) in it's record database, because they are> only interested in what is fastest/furthest/biggest/ etc etc. It is> up the IUF to keep more detailed records with separate categories.> *
I'd agree with that if geared unis become widely available. Fixed = a standard unicycle, ie. anything that's a single wheel of any size that is one to one geared with a fixed wheel and unlimited = anything that has one wheel and is entirely propelled by human power.
Otherwise you end up with tons of different things and have to work on complicated categories and definitions.
Gild - the point about requiring more skill to ride a higher geared uni, is interesting, but in my experience, for just going forwards and turning a bit you can adapt to a different wheel size / crank size etc. pretty easily and I don't see why gearing will be different. What makes unicycling fast difficult at the moment is spinning, I can't believe that it's more skillful to spin at half the speed. What's interesting about geared unicycles isn't extra skill, it's the extra fitness required to spin at the same spinnyness, because you'll be going faster.
If we were to decide that only people with access to equal technology were allowed to break records, the only category available would the the "shoeless running" record.
Right now, anyone with $1300 can buy a geared unicycle. For another $1000 you could certainly have it built into a bigger wheel (36"). In bicycle racing, $2300 hardly even gets you into the sport.
The furthest distance ridden in one hour on a unicycle should be just that. The furthest distance ridden in one hour on a unicycle.
If the record was "The furthest distance ridden in one hour on a non-geared, direct-drive 24" unicyle with 4" cranks" then that would be different.
As more people gain "access to technology" this record will be further challenged.
Hello @all Sorry my bad english I rode this record with a 26" Uni and 125mm (5") Cranks. You can't compare a record with 36" uni and a record with 26" Uni
Hello @all Sorry my bad english I rode this record with a 26" Uni and 125mm (5") Cranks. You can't compare a record with 36" uni and a record with 26" Uni
