In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?

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GYXU > Cycling > In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? 31 March 2005 06:31:08

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In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?
United we Stand 31 March 2005 06:31:08
	In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?
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SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim 22 February 2005 16:13:25 [ permanent link ]
	If we believe you religious fruitcakes, then abortion is MURDER, which means it must be allright, because the bible is the word of the WORST MASS MURDERER of all time, god. "United we Stand" <send@me.some.spam> wrote in message news:1434926.74ltj3DpDz@yahoo.com...> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?
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BanditManDan 22 February 2005 16:53:26 [ permanent link ]
	United we Stand Wrote: > In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? Take this conversation to a religous forum! -- BanditManDan
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Paul Anderson 22 February 2005 17:07:07 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:48:06 -0800, United we Stand <send@me.some.spam> wrote: In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? No. He said that the anti-abortionists are wrong.
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Zadok 22 February 2005 17:13:40 [ permanent link ]
	"United we Stand" <> wrote in message ... In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? After saying: why do atheists give themselves numbers like AA #2104> Apatriot #22> Atheist #3 do these totalitarian commie red lib bastards feel insecure without a number? Of course a smart guy, like United, could go to bible gateway, pop in abortion, and see for ones self, if Jesus ever mentioned abortion. But as his atheist post shows, United is not the brightest spoke in the wheel. Smile.
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Maggie 22 February 2005 17:42:06 [ permanent link ]
	BanditManDan wrote:> United we Stand Wrote:> > In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?> Take this conversation to a religous forum!> --> BanditManDan How does this religious stuff get on here. Not that I am ever on topic, but at least I try. I start off on topic, it just winds around to something totally off topic. I have no control over that. All Good Things, Maggie
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Lazarus 22 February 2005 18:30:23 [ permanent link ]
	"United we Stand" <send@me.some.spam> wrote... In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? Please do not feed the trolls.
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Kathryn 22 February 2005 21:58:00 [ permanent link ]
	"Zadok" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote in message news:8eGSd.24813$NN.5883@edtnps89...> "United we Stand" <> wrote in message ...> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?> After saying:> why do atheists give themselves numbers like> AA #2104>> Apatriot #22>> Atheist #3> do these totalitarian commie red lib bastards feel insecure without a> number?> Of course a smart guy, like United, could go to bible gateway, pop in> abortion, and see for ones self, if Jesus ever mentioned abortion.> But as his atheist post shows, United is not the brightest spoke in the> wheel.> Smile.> Got a social security number?
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Cartlon Shew 23 February 2005 00:51:38 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:13:40 GMT, "Zadok" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote: "United we Stand" <> wrote in message ...> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?> After saying:> why do atheists give themselves numbers like> AA #2104>> Apatriot #22>> Atheist #3> do these totalitarian commie red lib bastards feel insecure without a>number?> Of course a smart guy, like United, could go to bible gateway, pop in>abortion, and see for ones self, if Jesus ever mentioned abortion.> But as his atheist post shows, United is not the brightest spoke in the>wheel.> Brightest spoke? Smile. I am.
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Doktorf 23 February 2005 01:56:59 [ permanent link ]
	I don't think Jesus himself ever makes any reference to it. In the old testement, God hands Moses a rule book that commands that humans "not kill" and Jesus being a follower of Moses probably subscribed to that notion. "Not kill" is generally interpreted as "not commit murder". Murder is a very narrow, specific type of killing that is proscribed by law. Under current law in the United States, legal execution, killing in war, police shooting a criminal threatening the public safety, in some states euthanasia and , of course, abortion are not so defined. Now, I don't want to be accused by a theist of putting words in the mouth of the almighty, so I will try not to attach false interpretations to it. The commandment simply says "thou shalt not kill." That's as simple as it gets. It coveres everything right there. It is so general that it probably covers animals and plants (who also possess lives) as well as humans, so one is moved to wonder how God expects the humans to obtain nourishment. Obviously there is a contradiction between that and God's promise to Adam and Eve that they shall have dominion over all the other plants and animals, but perhaps his commandments to Moses were intended to over ride that. Christians say that the word of Jesus over rides the word of Moses, which brings us back to the fact that he never really went on the record on the issue one way or the other.
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Duke 23 February 2005 03:20:06 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:48:06 -0800, United we Stand <send@me.some.spam> wrote: In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? Yep - He said when you do to the least of mine, you do to me. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Duke 23 February 2005 03:20:55 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 12:13:25 GMT, "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <killgod@killgod.com> wrote: If we believe you religious fruitcakes, then abortion is MURDER, which means >it must be allright, because the bible is the word of the WORST MASS >MURDERER of all time, god. Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Doktorf 23 February 2005 06:23:46 [ permanent link ]
	Well, that makes it even easier. If you can apply any meaning you want to what's in there, then you don't even need the book anymore. It's possible to be self-rightious without a reference text and easier to modify the stance on an ad hoc basis.
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Junegill 23 February 2005 06:54:08 [ permanent link ]
	"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message news:igfn11huqqeegqdpfshhbm2ddigqb3vopc@4ax.com...> On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:48:06 -0800, United we Stand <send@me.some.spam> wrote:> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?> Yep - He said when you do to the least of mine, you do to me. So when you force an unwilling woman to go through the agony of childbirth, you're forcing Jesus to go through that agony too? -- June G # 364 http://uk.geocities.com/junegill@btopenworld.com/webpages/index.html.html
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Ron Wallenfang 23 February 2005 09:27:05 [ permanent link ]
	No. He doesn't mention the subject. The earliest explicit Christian condemnation of abortion, so far as I know, is in the Didache, in the early 2nd century. He also didn't explicitly tell me to ride my bicycle regularly to a Milwaukee abortion clinic to pray. "United we Stand" <send@me.some.spam> wrote in message news:1434926.74ltj3DpDz@yahoo.com...> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?
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Duke 23 February 2005 14:44:44 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:54:08 +0000 (UTC), "junegill" <junegill@btinternet.com> wrote: So when you force an unwilling woman to go through the agony of childbirth,>you're forcing Jesus to go through that agony too? That was, and still is, a woman's choice. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Matt Eckold 23 February 2005 16:49:04 [ permanent link ]
	Believe it or not back street aborstions did not exist in 25AD; i don't think coathangers did either.....
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Paul Anderson 23 February 2005 17:56:53 [ permanent link ]
	On 23 Feb 2005 04:49:04 -0800, matt.eckold@gmail.com wrote: Believe it or not back street aborstions did not exist in 25AD; i don't>think coathangers did either..... Coathangers did exist, as people did have coats and did have a need to hang them up. 'back street aborstions' in the meaning of illegal abortions did not exist because abortion was not illegal. Legal abortions did exist, were common knowledge, and Jesus said nothing against them. He did speak toward the anti-abortionists of today -- judge not, don't lie, etc...
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The other Donald 23 February 2005 18:57:05 [ permanent link ]
	"Ron Wallenfang" <rwallenfang@wi.rr.com> wrote in message news:JuUSd.13282$3V3.3044@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...> No. He doesn't mention the subject. The earliest explicit Christian> condemnation of abortion, so far as I know, is in the Didache, in the early> 2nd century. Except that, under "UWS's" very narrow question, Jesus didn't say it, and it wasn't in the Christian Bible. Hosea mentions the concept, but, according to the moron known as "UWS," that's not the Christian Bible. -- -Donald in Austin AA #2104 Apatriot #22 Atheist FF/EMT ....and ordained minister Stork pin recipient: May 1, 2003 -Madelyn
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Junegill 23 February 2005 21:50:43 [ permanent link ]
	"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message news:cjno1117ppgtfqdn555asbcf9o47mjv0c8@4ax.com...> On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:54:08 +0000 (UTC), "junegill" <junegill@btinternet.com>> wrote:> So when you force an unwilling woman to go through the agony of childbirth,> >you're forcing Jesus to go through that agony too?> That was, and still is, a woman's choice. It's a choice which you wish to remove though, isn't it? -- June G # 364 http://uk.geocities.com/junegill@btopenworld.com/webpages/index.html.html
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Cartlon Shew 24 February 2005 00:36:52 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:20:55 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote: On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 12:13:25 GMT, "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim"><killgod@killgod.com> wrote:> If we believe you religious fruitcakes, then abortion is MURDER, which means >>it must be allright, because the bible is the word of the WORST MASS >>MURDERER of all time, god.> Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does.> Except for that time when he wiped out EVERYONE on the planet except for 1 family duke>***>Matthew 22>14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." "Many are cold, but few are frozen." - ***
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Doktorf 24 February 2005 01:45:41 [ permanent link ]
	According to the holy book of the Jewish people, they were saved in the ark of the covenant that was kept in the sanctuary of the temple of Solomon. When the temple was destroyed, legend says the ark ant the tablets were lost.
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Michael Voytinsky 24 February 2005 01:48:31 [ permanent link ]
	United we Stand wrote: In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? Nowhere in the Bible does it say that abortion is wrong, except in so far as it is a property crime against the woman's husband. The people who say that the Bible states that it is murder are simply lying.
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Duke 24 February 2005 03:16:17 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 13:36:52 -0700, Cartlon Shew <cashew@lapaz.com> wrote: Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does.>Except for that time when he wiped out EVERYONE on the planet except>for 1 family God shot everyone? Well, if you read the bible, everyone but that 1 family was evil. And evil will not succeed. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Duke 24 February 2005 03:17:19 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:50:43 +0000 (UTC), "junegill" <junegill@btinternet.com> wrote: So when you force an unwilling woman to go through the agony of>childbirth,>> >you're forcing Jesus to go through that agony too?>> That was, and still is, a woman's choice.>It's a choice which you wish to remove though, isn't it? I have no idea what your question is. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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S o r n i 24 February 2005 05:38:16 [ permanent link ]
	It's not listed in the index of "The Bicycle Wheel". Bill "hey look, I remembered to trim cross-posted groups!" S.
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Pat Winstanley 24 February 2005 11:23:40 [ permanent link ]
	In article <0ifn11deg5ovhfgogddg8g6pd2rv11bv1f@4ax.com>, duckgumbo32 @cox.net says...> On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 12:13:25 GMT, "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim"> <killgod@killgod.com> wrote:> If we believe you religious fruitcakes, then abortion is MURDER, which means > >it must be allright, because the bible is the word of the WORST MASS > >MURDERER of all time, god.> Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does.> Who, or what, 'pulls the trigger' that kills off (causes to be flushed out) the vast majority (about three quarters IIRC) of fertilised human ova before they even implant themselves in the woman's tissues? It's not an active attempt by the woman (she normally doesn't even know there is a fertilised ovum at that point). Ditto for the man. So who or what does that 'discard and destroy' of the blastocysts/embryos?
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Pat Winstanley 24 February 2005 11:32:44 [ permanent link ]
	In article <1109162944.912082.111090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, matt.eckold@gmail.com says...> Believe it or not back street aborstions did not exist in 25AD; i don't> think coathangers did either.....> What makes you think that? Abortion (induced) was certainly well known centuries before that time - usually performed by the woman ingesting herbs or other plants that caused the pregnancy to miscarry, sometimes accidentally ingested by the woman with the same effect. Surely you don't think abortion is a modern invention just because it can now be performed much like any other minor medical/surgical treatment with little or no harm to the woman! The techniques have become safe (except for rare exceptions) for the woman over time, but one or more techniques have been in use for thousands of years despite a lack of modern medicine/technology. See here for some more information: http://www.atlanta-mfm.com/clindisc/vol1no3.html
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Cartlon Shew 25 February 2005 02:17:54 [ permanent link ]
	On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:16:17 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote: On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 13:36:52 -0700, Cartlon Shew <cashew@lapaz.com> wrote:> Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does.>>Except for that time when he wiped out EVERYONE on the planet except>>for 1 family> God shot everyone?> Sorry - "pull the trigger" was someone elses metaphor for causing death. It's a pretty simple concept actually - Didn't you take Engrish in school? Well, if you read the bible, everyone but that 1 family was evil. And evil will>not succeed. So how come there's so much evil in the world today? Or am I mistaken and there isn't as much evil as I think there is? duke>***>Matthew 22>14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." >***
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Duke 25 February 2005 03:46:53 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:23:40 -0000, Pat Winstanley <boredofspam2004@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does. Who, or what, 'pulls the trigger' that kills off (causes to be flushed >out) the vast majority (about three quarters IIRC) of fertilised human >ova before they even implant themselves in the woman's tissues? Mankind in his failure to be as God. It's not >an active attempt by the woman (she normally doesn't even know there >is a fertilised ovum at that point). Ditto for the man. So who or what >does that 'discard and destroy' of the blastocysts/embryos? It's a result of sin. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Duke 25 February 2005 03:48:23 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 01:35:03 +0000 (UTC), "junegill" <junegill@btinternet.com> wrote: Sorry that it wasn't clear enough; I'll try again. I think that you wish to>outlaw abortion, thereby removing the pregnant woman's choice of avoiding>the agony of childbirth, should she not wish to carry to term: is that so? Of course not. Abortion is the ultimate act of selfishness, an act so horrendous that a woman would actually butcher her own unborn for her own comfort and convenience. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Junegill 25 February 2005 08:20:49 [ permanent link ]
	"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message news:8sps111hfkc3bq4ou6gc4gd3huuq6i224i@4ax.com...> On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 01:35:03 +0000 (UTC), "junegill" <junegill@btinternet.com>> wrote:> Sorry that it wasn't clear enough; I'll try again. I think that you wish outlaw abortion, thereby removing the pregnant woman's choice of avoiding> >the agony of childbirth, should she not wish to carry to term: is that so?> Of course not. I think you mean 'of course', but whatever. So, going back to your original statement about whatever you do to anyone you do to Jesus, that means that you would force Jesus to suffer that agony. I wonder what He would think of your attitude. Abortion is the ultimate act of selfishness, Oh, you've got to love it - yet another man, smug in the knowledge that he will never have to go through pregnancy and childbirth himself, pontificating about what those who do have to suffer it should do. You have no idea whether the motivation of a woman who aborts is selfish or not - it can be the very opposite. an act so> horrendous that a woman would actually butcher her own unborn for her own> comfort and convenience. And your God 'butchers' about 60% of all conceptions, so it's pretty clear that He doesn't regard them very highly. -- June G # 364 http://uk.geocities.com/junegill@btopenworld.com/webpages/index.html.html
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Pat Winstanley 25 February 2005 18:34:39 [ permanent link ]
	In article <hops11p1ahgeri3eoflqfugsq41au056kj@4ax.com>, duckgumbo32 @cox.net says...> >> Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does.> Who, or what, 'pulls the trigger' that kills off (causes to be flushed > >out) the vast majority (about three quarters IIRC) of fertilised human > >ova before they even implant themselves in the woman's tissues?> Mankind in his failure to be as God.> ROFLROFLROFL!!!!! You've lost it, mate!
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Duke 25 February 2005 23:45:01 [ permanent link ]
	On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 14:34:39 -0000, Pat Winstanley <boredofspam2004@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: Mankind in his failure to be as God.>ROFLROFLROFL!!!!!>You've lost it, mate! Not a chance, mate. duke *** Matthew 22 14"For many are invited, but few are chosen." ***
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Maggie 26 February 2005 05:32:16 [ permanent link ]
	S o r n i wrote:> It's not listed in the index of "The Bicycle Wheel".> Bill "hey look, I remembered to trim cross-posted groups!" S. Maybe someday people will accept us for who we are Bill. Cross posting lunatics who type too much. Maggie (Understands Bill)
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Laura Bush murdered her boy friend 26 February 2005 08:50:00 [ permanent link ]
	Cartlon Shew wrote:> On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:20:55 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:> On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 12:13:25 GMT, "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim"> ><killgod@killgod.com> wrote:> > If we believe you religious fruitcakes, then abortion is MURDER, which means> >>it must be allright, because the bible is the word of the WORST MASS> >>MURDERER of all time, god.> > Of course not. God doesn't pull the trigger, man does.> > Except for that time when he wiped out EVERYONE on the planet except> for 1 family That wasn't god. It was the annunaki.
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Peter 26 February 2005 18:23:06 [ permanent link ]
	United we Stand <send@me.some.spam> wrote in message news:<1434926.74ltj3DpDz@yahoo.com>...> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? Ex. 20:13 "You shall not kill."! You are talking about human fetuses aren't you, and what would this fetus become if not a human in the image of God? This word kill in this application is recognized as "MURDER". The ten commandments were given by Christ in the form of the God of the Old Testament, see John 1 to varify this Peter
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Ray Fischer 27 February 2005 10:26:40 [ permanent link ]
	Peter <zwamahn@hotmail.com> wrote:>United we Stand <send@me.some.spam> wrote in message news:<1434926.74ltj3DpDz@yahoo.com>...>> In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong?> Ex. 20:13 "You shall not kill."! 1) That's not Jesus 2) Then why do you kill plants, insects, and animals? You are talking about human fetuses>aren't you, and what would this fetus become if not a human in the>image of God? So killing sperm is murder? This word kill in this application is recognized as>"MURDER". And abortion isn't murder. The ten commandments were given by Christ in the form of the>God of the Old Testament, see John 1 to varify this -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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Ray Fischer 28 February 2005 04:07:59 [ permanent link ]
	duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:>Oh, God is real alright. He said no more floods, but that's the OT concept of>physical death for the evil in the world.> Now it's the NT spiritual death, or spending an eternity in hell for what you>did in this lifetime. Use it wisely. God is waiting on you to wise up and>change your ways. And that's not a threat - it's a promise. When did God appoint you as His spokesman? -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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David W. Poole 28 February 2005 04:18:51 [ permanent link ]
	On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:07:59 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: When did God appoint you as His spokesman? He didn't, but the prior poster is relaying information that is contained in God's word.
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Ray Fischer 28 February 2005 06:50:05 [ permanent link ]
	David W. Poole, Jr. > rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) When did God appoint you as His spokesman?> He didn't, but the prior poster is relaying information that is>contained in God's word. What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very different things. -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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David W. Poole 28 February 2005 07:22:00 [ permanent link ]
	On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:50:05 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very>different things. Really? And when did God give you the right to make that distinction?
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Ray Fischer 28 February 2005 08:09:38 [ permanent link ]
	David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) > What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very>>different things.> Really? Really. And when did God give you the right to make that distinction? When Jesus walked the Earth. -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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David W. Poole 28 February 2005 08:55:58 [ permanent link ]
	On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:09:38 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:>> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) >> What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very>>>different things.>> Really?> Really.> And when did God give you the right to make that distinction?> When Jesus walked the Earth. Elaborate. Nothing I read leads me to believe that Jesus's presence on terra firma advocates discarding the OT.
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Ray Fischer 28 February 2005 09:40:41 [ permanent link ]
	David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:>On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:09:38 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray>Fischer) was understood to have stated the following:> David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:>>> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) >>> What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very>>>>different things.>>> Really?>> Really.>> And when did God give you the right to make that distinction?>> When Jesus walked the Earth.> Elaborate. Nothing I read leads me to believe that Jesus's presence on>terra firma advocates discarding the OT. Nothing in the Bible appoints you as ANY sort of judge about the rules other people are expected to follow. In fact Jesus said more than once that YOU are not to make the rules nor are you to make other people obey rules you come up with. -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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Ray Fischer 1 March 2005 07:32:47 [ permanent link ]
	David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) >>David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote: What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very>>>>>>different things.>>>>> Really?>>>> Really.>>>> And when did God give you the right to make that distinction?>>>> When Jesus walked the Earth.>>> Elaborate. Nothing I read leads me to believe that Jesus's presence on>>>terra firma advocates discarding the OT.>> Nothing in the Bible appoints you as ANY sort of judge about the rules>>other people are expected to follow. In fact Jesus said more than>>once that YOU are not to make the rules nor are you to make other>>people obey rules you come up with.> We are expected to correctly handle the word of truth, What part of "you don't make the rules" are you too stupid to understand? and anyone>stating the Bible condones abortion is not properly handling it. "Properly" according to you. You're just an immoral control freak using the Bible for your own ends. -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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Xeton2001IsAMoron 20 dwpj65 1 March 2005 08:31:12 [ permanent link ]
	Demonstrate you're handling the Bible in the proper manner, as so far all you've demonstrated is that you're an immoral control freak using the Bible for your own ends. Where in the Bible does it state that abortion is sanctioned?
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David W. Poole 1 March 2005 11:38:07 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 07:23:48 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: Is it right for YOU to commit a crime for what you think is a good?> No. Hitler obviously thought murdering numerous jews was good. Does that mean he did not sin?
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Junegill 1 March 2005 23:24:36 [ permanent link ]
	"David W. Poole, Jr." <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote in message news:ekc921h5o9c0888mopiteohl9n362789l7@4ax.com...> On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:16:08 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray> Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: [snip] Provide a biblical reference that says> >>>>abortion is ok.> >>> Numbers 5 describes a forced abortion. Why are you ignoring Numbers 5? [snip] -- June G # 364 http://uk.geocities.com/junegill@btopenworld.com/webpages/index.html.html
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Xeton2001IsAMoron 20 dwpj65 2 March 2005 01:12:38 [ permanent link ]
	junegill wrote:> "David W. Poole, Jr."> <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote message news:ekc921h5o9c0888mopiteohl9n362789l7@4ax.com...> > On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:16:08 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray> > Fischer) was understood to have stated the following:> [snip]> Provide a biblical reference that says> > >>>>abortion is ok.> > >>> Numbers 5 describes a forced abortion.> Why are you ignoring Numbers 5?> Perhaps because you're ignoring the rest of the Bible?
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Xeton2001IsAMoron 20 dwpj65 2 March 2005 05:49:16 [ permanent link ]
	Ok, I read Numbers 5 in NIV, NKJV, KJV, NASB, and NLT. I still don't see the abortion reference.
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Murdoc 2 March 2005 13:00:17 [ permanent link ]
	Ray Fischer wrote: David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:> > On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:09:38 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray> > Fischer) was understood to have stated the following:> > David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:> >>> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) > > > > What you claim is God's word and what is God's word are two very> > > > > different things.> > > > Really?> > > Really.> > > And when did God give you the right to make that distinction?> > > When Jesus walked the Earth.> > Elaborate. Nothing I read leads me to believe that Jesus's presence on> > terra firma advocates discarding the OT.> Nothing in the Bible appoints you as ANY sort of judge about the rules> other people are expected to follow. In fact Jesus said more than> once that YOU are not to make the rules nor are you to make other> people obey rules you come up with. Prove it. -- Murdoc Posted with XanaNews v1.17.2.7 "Perfectionism is the enemy of creation, as extreme self-solicitude is the enemy of well-being." -- John Updike
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David W. Poole 3 March 2005 10:01:00 [ permanent link ]
	On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:58:20 -0700, Cartlon Shew <cashew@lapaz.com> was understood to have stated the following: "It is a gift of god, not of works, lest any man should boast" But it also says that the gift of salvation will be evidenced by the works.
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Paul Anderson 3 March 2005 10:23:03 [ permanent link ]
	On 2 Mar 2005 19:11:35 -0800, zwamahn@hotmail.com (Peter) wrote: rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote >> Peter <zwamahn@hotmail.com> wrote: ... In the Bible, does Jesus say abortion is wrong? Ex. 20:13 "You shall not kill."! ....>> >> 2) Then why do you kill plants, insects, and animals? * Plants, insects and animals are not sentient let alone human, So what? Does Ex. 20:13 say anything about "sentient" or "human"? So what???? Kill in Ex. 20:13 IS talking about MURDER, you can't>murder a plant!! * Abortion is not and never has been murder. Which returns us to the original question: where in the Bible does it say abortion is wrong? ... * Well? How is abortion not murder?????? * How is abortion murder? Bear in mind that abortion is not and never has been considered to be murder, except in anti-abortion rhetoric. Anti-abortionists claim that abortion is muder, no legal authority has ever agreed. The burden of proof is upon the one making the unusual claim. Since abortion has never been considered to be murder by any legal authority there is no need to show how abortion is not murder -- that is the status quo, the conservative 'the way it has always been' position. It is up to the Pro-Lifers to show how abortion is muder when no legal authority has ever agreed with them.
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Cartlon Shew 3 March 2005 21:31:33 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 01:01:00 -0500, "David W. Poole, Jr." <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote: On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 15:58:20 -0700, Cartlon Shew <cashew@lapaz.com>>was understood to have stated the following:> "It is a gift of god, not of works, lest any man should boast"> But it also says that the gift of salvation will be evidenced by the>works.> "For by grace are you saved through faith"
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Maggie 3 March 2005 23:22:04 [ permanent link ]
	HOW DO YOU GET THIS DUMBASS THREAD TO STOP!! All Good things, Maggie
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Tom Keats 3 March 2005 23:45:24 [ permanent link ]
	In article <1109877724.308639.238990@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "Maggie" <lbuset@allsecretarial.com> writes:> HOW DO YOU GET THIS DUMBASS THREAD TO STOP!! By not responding to it, thereby letting it die naturally. I see you trimmed a bunch of cross-posts. Thank you In the meantime you could put the subject in your killfile, if you have one. I just "mark thread as read" whenever the thread shows up in my newsreader. cheers, Tom -- -- Nothing is safe from me. Above address is just a spam midden. I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca
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Ben Kaufman 4 March 2005 03:59:46 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 11:45:24 -0800, tomk2003@hotmail.com (Tom Keats) wrote: In article <1109877724.308639.238990@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,>"Maggie" <lbuset@allsecretarial.com> writes:>> HOW DO YOU GET THIS DUMBASS THREAD TO STOP!!> By not responding to it, thereby letting it die naturally.> I see you trimmed a bunch of cross-posts. Thank you > In the meantime you could put the subject in your killfile,>if you have one. I just "mark thread as read" whenever the>thread shows up in my newsreader.> cheers,>Tom I just put them all in my kill file - older and wiser
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Ray Fischer 4 March 2005 09:09:04 [ permanent link ]
	Peter <zwamahn@hotmail.com> wrote:>*** Here you are in a Christian NG putting man's law above that of the>Eternals, Ex. 20:13, "Thou shalt not KILL..." And if English was good enough for Moses then it's good enough for you. is not talking about>anything other than human life. Where does it say that? Or are YOU putting your own rules above God's laws? -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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David W. Poole 4 March 2005 10:22:22 [ permanent link ]
	On 3 Mar 2005 21:12:42 GMT, "Murdoc" <murdoc_0@hotmail.com> was understood to have stated the following: Matthew 5:39-41 (NIV)>39 But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to>him the other also. 40 And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak>as well. 41 If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.> What, exactly, does that have to do with abortion, Ray? He believes it means that if a woman asks for an abortion, you must provide her with one. Oddly enough, he hasn't seemed to be interested in answering what action I should take if that same woman asked me to kill the man that impregnated her. All he seems to be capable of doing is accusing others of possessing his faults, and jumping up and down like a two year old throwing a tantrum. He's a far cry from the father of lies, but he's trying.
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David W. Poole 4 March 2005 10:25:19 [ permanent link ]
	On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 05:09:04 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: Peter <zwamahn@hotmail.com> wrote:>>*** Here you are in a Christian NG putting man's law above that of the>>Eternals, Ex. 20:13, "Thou shalt not KILL..." > And if English was good enough for Moses then it's good enough for you.> is not talking about>>anything other than human life.> Where does it say that? Or are YOU putting your own rules above God's>laws? Evidently you just want to skip Exodus 20:13, like it doesn't exist. Good work! Way to go Ray!
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David W. Poole 4 March 2005 10:34:44 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 19:19:48 +0000 (UTC), "junegill" <junegill@btinternet.com> was understood to have stated the following: Ultimately I don't believe that Jesus speaks against abortion, but>> then again I don't think He believed He had to. Exodus 20:13 condemns>> killing,> And Exodus 21:22-25 sets the penalty for causing a woman to miscarry as a>mere fine. Actually, it's a mere fine if the child is born prematurely, and no further harm is done. "If the result is death, the offender must be executed." and, as quoted before, John 1:1-4 & 14 proclaim Jesus to be>> God's word in the flesh. It's just that some, like Mr. Fischer, seem>> to have difficulty with John 1:5. Also be advised that being deceived>> is rather easy.> Ray also quoted Numbers 5 to you, but you seem to want to ignore this. Why? Because Numbers 5 says nothing about abortion; only providing a bitter drink that causes the woman to swell. I've known several women who I've seen swell because of digestive track issues, not due to pregnancy. Do all liberals have such reading comprehension issues, or is it just the ones that post on usenet?
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David W. Poole 4 March 2005 10:35:43 [ permanent link ]
	On Thu, 3 Mar 2005 06:48:50 -0000, Pat Winstanley <boredofspam2004@yahoo.co.uk> was understood to have stated the following: In article <ekc921h5o9c0888mopiteohl9n362789l7@4ax.com>, >TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com says...>> No, I've made the statement numerous times when a human being is>> created. >> The following defines (across pretty much the whole world) when the >status of 'human being' (or 'person') begins.> Would you like to demonstrate that these laws are all somehow wrong? So when Hitler made it legal to kill the jews, he was in the right?
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Ray Fischer 4 March 2005 22:30:26 [ permanent link ]
	David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) >>Peter <zwamahn@hotmail.com> wrote: *** Here you are in a Christian NG putting man's law above that of the>>>Eternals, Ex. 20:13, "Thou shalt not KILL..." >> And if English was good enough for Moses then it's good enough for you.>> is not talking about>>>anything other than human life.>> Where does it say that? Or are YOU putting your own rules above God's>>laws?> Evidently you just want to skip Exodus 20:13, like it doesn't exist. Like a typical pro-liar you resort to lies whenever your hate-filled ideology is challenged. That passage from Exodus says NOTHING that has anything to do with abortion. -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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David W. Poole 4 March 2005 22:51:41 [ permanent link ]
	On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 18:30:26 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) was understood to have stated the following: Like a typical pro-liar you resort to lies whenever your hate-filled>ideology is challenged. That passage from Exodus says NOTHING that>has anything to do with abortion. It says a lot more about it than any of the scriptural references you've provided.
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Maggie 5 March 2005 00:01:44 [ permanent link ]
	Tom Keats wrote:> In article <1109877724.308639.238990@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,> "Maggie" <lbuset@allsecretarial.com> writes:> > HOW DO YOU GET THIS DUMBASS THREAD TO STOP!!> By not responding to it, thereby letting it die naturally.> I see you trimmed a bunch of cross-posts. Thank you > In the meantime you could put the subject in your killfile,> if you have one. I just "mark thread as read" whenever the> thread shows up in my newsreader.> cheers,> Tom> The one thing I have yet to figure out is the kilfile. How do you put a thread in a kilfile? I am going to have to figure this out. I know there are people who have kilfiled me, but to tell you the truth the really technical posts I just pass over. I'd rather not even see them. I don't plan to build a bike, I will be lucky if I ever change a tire. I might break a nail. Can you imagine being a man in my "REAL" life? I wonder how they put up with me. They can't kilfile me. Maybe they can kill me, but they can't ignore me. All Good Things, Maggie.> --> -- Nothing is safe from me.> Above address is just a spam midden.> I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca
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James G. Keegan Jr. 5 March 2005 01:14:28 [ permanent link ]
	"David W. Poole, Jr." <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65 @spamgourmet.com> wrote in news:8pvf219s9bv9q27694ogro3f4e8bolts2q@4ax.com: On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 05:09:04 GMT, rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray> Fischer) was understood to have stated the following:>>Where does it say that? Or are YOU putting your own rules above God's>>laws?> Evidently you just want to skip Exodus 20:13, like it doesn't exist. it doesn't exist for 75+% of the world population. for that huge majority, it is just a segment of someone else's religious book. for the few who do recognize it, it says nothing of abortion. it is not uncommon for religious fruitcakes to misreprsent the codes of their religion.
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Pat Winstanley 5 March 2005 05:12:48 [ permanent link ]
	In article <cc834b35.0503031713.31714fc8@posting.google.com>, zwamahn@hotmail.com says...> Here you are in a Christian NG > This is talk.abortion... where I'm reading - which a perfectly accectable group in which to discuss reproduction and reproductive rights, laws etc. It's interesting to know what people think various religious tomes say about the issue, but not seriously relevant except to pregnant woman of that particular religious bent who may feel that she would like religious suggestions in how to deal with her pregnancy.
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Pat Winstanley 5 March 2005 05:16:33 [ permanent link ]
	In article <6rvf2190cme4sjho46c5d0u0utlf389ktv@4ax.com>, TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com says...> Actually, it's a mere fine if the child is born prematurely, and no> further harm is done. "If the result is death, the offender must be> executed."> That's the woman's death! The husband is to be compensated for the death of his wife (who in those times/places was the husband's possession... just like his goats, tent, clothes etc).
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Ray Fischer 5 March 2005 08:01:46 [ permanent link ]
	David W. Poole, Jr. <TedKennedyMurderedHisPregnantMistress.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com> wrote:> rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) Like a typical pro-liar you resort to lies whenever your hate-filled>>ideology is challenged. That passage from Exodus says NOTHING that>>has anything to do with abortion.> It says a lot more about it than any of the scriptural references>you've provided. Like what? Abortion isn't murder and never has been so it obviously doesn't apply. -- Ray Fischer rfischer@sonic.net
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Just zis Guy 5 March 2005 14:48:15 [ permanent link ]
	On 3 Mar 2005 17:13:28 -0800, zwamahn@hotmail.com (Peter) wrote in message <cc834b35.0503031713.31714fc8@posting.google.com>: Thou shalt not KILL An excellent rule for life. I presume you are active against capital punishment? Guy -- May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.