My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of the left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to reach without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard when shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no experience with Campy. Just looking for some help or ideas. Chris
Qui Si Parla Campagnolo 23 March 2005 17:48:18 [ permanent link ]
Chris Dorn wrote:> My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of the > left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to reach > without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard when > shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no experience > with Campy. Just looking for some help or ideas.> Chris
With a smaller, closer shift lever and the ratcheting friction type shifter, where she can click it once, return to center, click it again, etc, Campagnolo left/front shifter is much more forgiving for those with small hands.
Mike Jacoubowsky 23 March 2005 20:16:35 [ permanent link ]
My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of the > left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to reach > without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard when shifting > into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no experience with Campy. > Just looking for some help or ideas.> Chris
Sometimes people mistake having to push the lever hard to shift with what's really required... not so much pressure, but rather holding it in place for a bit. STI takes a bit of time to "catch" the chain and move it up. It's not the same technique as the rear derailleur, where you can quickly blip it and expect the chain to move from cog-to-cog.
When a bike is brand new, the chain will be a bit stiffer and will often make the more-difficult upshift on the front without so much trouble. But it doesn't take long for it to become looser and require a bit of help. Remember, it's not how hard you push, but rather that you hold it in place for a bit.
Also, make sure the cable is running freely. Check where it goes under the bottom bracket; a bit of grease there might help.
Also, remember that Shimano does have a women's shifter available, with a smaller, easier-to-use lever. An expensive option, but for some they work a lot better, and I'm sure she could try one out on a bike at the shop that has them.
On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 07:54:05 -0500, Chris Dorn <cdorn1971-newsgroups@yahoo.com> wrote:
My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of the > left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to reach >without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard when >shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no experience >with Campy. Just looking for some help or ideas.>Chris
Hi, have you checked the shifter, to make sure it is functioning properly? When I road tested my LeMond, I couldn't shift on to the big ring. I was concerned that it was just that hard to do. I have some problems with my hands, the left missing two fingers and the two remaining are webbed together. Well the LBS mechanic, checked it and said it wasn't right. They replaced the cable and I had no problem after that.
So, you might want to start by optimizing what you have, before spending a lot on new Campy levers.
"Chris Dorn" <cdorn1971-newsgroups@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1142pn3913oksde@corp.supernews.com...> My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of the > left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to reach > without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard when shifting > into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no experience with Campy. > Just looking for some help or ideas.> Chris
One other thing that no one has mentioned is to check that the chainrings match. (53B goes with 39B, and 53A goes with 42A -- typical road bike examples) You can certainly use unmatched rings or rings without modified teeth, but there should be some improvement when using a matched set.
In addition to what Mike said about pushing the lever, make sure she is easing up on the pedals when shifting to a bigger ring.
Squid-in-Training Phil 23 March 2005 22:13:48 [ permanent link ]
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>> My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of>> the left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to>> reach without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard>> when shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no>> experience with Campy. Just looking for some help or ideas.>> Chris>
Check this page on our website-> http://www.chainreaction.com/shifting.htm> Sometimes people mistake having to push the lever hard to shift with> what's really required... not so much pressure, but rather holding it> in place for a bit. STI takes a bit of time to "catch" the chain and> move it up. It's not the same technique as the rear derailleur, where> you can quickly blip it and expect the chain to move from cog-to-cog.
Almost every entry-level road bike that goes out at my shop comes back with "the front clatters" explicitly because they don't hold it in. Shimano really needs to have a little tag on the left shifter explaining this.
"Phil, Squid-in-Training" <phil_leeIHEARTBASHGUARDS@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:wli0e.2036$kI3.1540@fe07.usenetserver.com...> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>>> My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of>>> the left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to>>> reach without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard>>> when shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no>>> experience with Campy. Just looking for some help or ideas.>>> Chris>>
Check this page on our website->> http://www.chainreaction.com/shifting.htm>> Sometimes people mistake having to push the lever hard to shift with>> what's really required... not so much pressure, but rather holding it>> in place for a bit. STI takes a bit of time to "catch" the chain and>> move it up. It's not the same technique as the rear derailleur, where>> you can quickly blip it and expect the chain to move from cog-to-cog.>
Almost every entry-level road bike that goes out at my shop comes back > with "the front clatters" explicitly because they don't hold it in. > Shimano really needs to have a little tag on the left shifter explaining > this.>
-- > Phil, Squid-in-Training
Is it different with Campy, and why?
Another thing that is not obvious about the left Shim lever is that a half swing of the lever will trim the front der to stop noise in a bad combination such as big ring, big cog.
Mike Jacoubowsky 24 March 2005 05:04:47 [ permanent link ]
Almost every entry-level road bike that goes out at my shop comes back > with "the front clatters" explicitly because they don't hold it in. > Shimano really needs to have a little tag on the left shifter explaining > this.
Which is why I put up that web page. You might think it's because I'm incredibly altruistic and want to make the world a better place for cycling, but the real reason is because, with something on-line that I can point to, they're more likely to believe me when I tell them that something's not defective, but they need to use it a bit differently.
Same thing for this page- www.ChainReaction.com/chainrings.htm I got enough phone calls from people over the years regarding their "defective" brand-new bike with missing chainring teeth... who absolutely would not believe me when I told them that's the way it was made... that putting up the stuff on the 'web became a way to keep my sanity.
The amazing thing is that people will believe virtually ANYTHING they read on the 'web, the problem being that you can do a web search and support just about any conclusion you've already reached.
My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw of the > left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long enough to reach > without causing her to swerve because she is pushing so hard when > shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be easier? I have no experience > with Campy. Just looking for some help or ideas.> Chris
The Ergo may be shifted in a couple of short passes in succession rather than one long hard-to-reach motion
Thanks all for your suggestions. I think I will give her a little time to see if she can develop the technique for shifting STI's. If she cannot then I will look into Ergos, they seem like a good alternative. Chris
Thanks all for your suggestions. I think I will give her a little time> to see if she can develop the technique for shifting STI's. If she> cannot then I will look into Ergos, they seem like a good alternative.> Chris
Qui Si Parla Campagnolo 24 March 2005 18:07:36 [ permanent link ]
Phil, Squid-in-Training wrote:
Almost every entry-level road bike that goes out at my shop comes back with > "the front clatters" explicitly because they don't hold it in. Shimano > really needs to have a little tag on the left shifter explaining this.>
Or design a front shifter that works better. We just got our first Ultegra 10s triple and 'smooth running' is NOT how I would describe the front der/triple. It is on the level of finnicky of the DA triple. I'm sure the DA 10s triple won't be any better.
Or design a front shifter that works better. We just got our first> Ultegra 10s triple and 'smooth running' is NOT how I would describe> the front der/triple. It is on the level of finnicky of the DA> triple. I'm sure the DA 10s triple won't be any better.
A fellow club member has been through at least three sets of DA shifters in a year. He just went to Campy in disgust.
Mike Jacoubowsky 25 March 2005 01:00:52 [ permanent link ]
A fellow club member has been through at least three sets of DA shifters > in a> year. He just went to Campy in disgust.>
Matt O.
But then there's a guy like me, with first-generation (pre-flight-deck) 9-speed D/A shifters, the ones that are supposedly the worst, and they've gone through multiple frames, gosh-awful weather (I ride no-matter-what) and 40k+ miles and still work fine.
Not to say that we haven't seen problems with some, but there are quite a few people who have never had issues, and of those who have, some are definitely related to crashing on them. Yeah, I'd like to see a tougher design, but failures in the field are not as common as some reading these threads would be led to believe.
--Mike Jacoubowsky Chain Reaction Bicycles www.ChainReaction.com Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
A fellow club member has been through at least three sets of DA>> shifters in a>> year. He just went to Campy in disgust.
But then there's a guy like me, with first-generation> (pre-flight-deck) 9-speed D/A shifters, the ones that are supposedly> the worst, and they've gone through multiple frames, gosh-awful> weather (I ride no-matter-what) and 40k+ miles and still work fine.>
Not to say that we haven't seen problems with some, but there are> quite a few people who have never had issues, and of those who have,> some are definitely related to crashing on them. Yeah, I'd like to> see a tougher design, but failures in the field are not as common as> some reading these threads would be led to believe.
Mike, this isn't rocket science. That any of these fail spontaneously, as they do, is completely unacceptable -- especially when they charge as much for them as they do.
One thing I would never do is buy these parts secondhand. If it breaks you're really SOL.
Squid-in-Training Phil 25 March 2005 06:41:40 [ permanent link ]
Art M wrote:> "Phil, Squid-in-Training" <phil_leeIHEARTBASHGUARDS@hotmail.com>> wrote in message news:wli0e.2036$kI3.1540@fe07.usenetserver.com...>> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>>>> My wife just started cycling and is having trouble with the throw>>>> of the left lever (front derailleur), her hands are not long>>>> enough to reach without causing her to swerve because she is>>>> pushing so hard when shifting into the big ring. Would Campy be>>>> easier? I have no experience with Campy. Just looking for some>>>> help or ideas. Chris>>>
Check this page on our website->>> http://www.chainreaction.com/shifting.htm>>> Sometimes people mistake having to push the lever hard to shift with>>> what's really required... not so much pressure, but rather holding>>> it in place for a bit. STI takes a bit of time to "catch" the chain>>> and move it up. It's not the same technique as the rear derailleur,>>> where you can quickly blip it and expect the chain to move from>>> cog-to-cog.>>
Almost every entry-level road bike that goes out at my shop comes>> back with "the front clatters" explicitly because they don't hold it>> in. Shimano really needs to have a little tag on the left shifter>> explaining this.>>
-->> Phil, Squid-in-Training>
Is it different with Campy, and why?>
Another thing that is not obvious about the left Shim lever is that a> half swing of the lever will trim the front der to stop noise in a bad> combination such as big ring, big cog.
Entry-level road bikes have Sora shifters, which don't have a trim function. These are probably 50% of the road bikes we sell.
Squid-in-Training Phil 25 March 2005 06:53:38 [ permanent link ]
Mike, this isn't rocket science. That any of these fail> spontaneously, as they do, is completely unacceptable -- especially> when they charge as much for them as they do.>
One thing I would never do is buy these parts secondhand. If it> breaks you're really SOL.
One of the joys of downtube shifters... cheap, reliable, and light! Not that I'll be winning any crits with them...
Mike Jacoubowsky 25 March 2005 08:25:33 [ permanent link ]
Mike, this isn't rocket science. That any of these fail spontaneously, as > they> do, is completely unacceptable -- especially when they charge as much for > them> as they do.>
It's extraordinarily rare that they fail "spontaneously." They're either DOA when new (which, I'll agree, isn't acceptable, but at least it's spotted before it leaves the shop) or they fail because a crash shoved the lever against the handlebar, bending it outward a bit. That can often cause failure; typically the customer says no, that never happened, and points to a lack of external damage to the lever as proof. But then you look at the handlebar and see the area where the lever smashed against the tape...
One thing I would never do is buy these parts secondhand. If it breaks
"Matt O'Toole" <matt@deltanet.com> wrote in message news:3agt1sF6big24U1@individual.net...> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>
A fellow club member has been through at least three sets of DA>>> shifters in a>>> year. He just went to Campy in disgust.>
But then there's a guy like me, with first-generation>> (pre-flight-deck) 9-speed D/A shifters, the ones that are supposedly>> the worst, and they've gone through multiple frames, gosh-awful>> weather (I ride no-matter-what) and 40k+ miles and still work fine.>>
Not to say that we haven't seen problems with some, but there are>> quite a few people who have never had issues, and of those who have,>> some are definitely related to crashing on them. Yeah, I'd like to>> see a tougher design, but failures in the field are not as common as>> some reading these threads would be led to believe.>
Mike, this isn't rocket science. That any of these fail spontaneously, as > they> do, is completely unacceptable -- especially when they charge as much for > them> as they do.>
One thing I would never do is buy these parts secondhand. If it breaks > you're> really SOL.>
Qui Si Parla Campagnolo 25 March 2005 17:58:46 [ permanent link ]
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>>A fellow club member has been through at least three sets of DA shifters >>in a>>year. He just went to Campy in disgust.>>
Matt O.>
But then there's a guy like me, with first-generation (pre-flight-deck) > 9-speed D/A shifters, the ones that are supposedly the worst, and they've > gone through multiple frames, gosh-awful weather (I ride no-matter-what) and > 40k+ miles and still work fine.>
Not to say that we haven't seen problems with some, but there are quite a > few people who have never had issues, and of those who have, some are > definitely related to crashing on them. Yeah, I'd like to see a tougher > design, but failures in the field are not as common as some reading these > threads would be led to believe.>
--Mike Jacoubowsky> Chain Reaction Bicycles> www.ChainReaction.com> Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA >
Gotta disagree Mike, from my experience. We don't sell a lot of shimano but we warranty perhaps 1-2 levers per month and have for 5 years. I think it's perhaps that those that buy bikes outta boxes come to us because the bike shops where they bought them give them the 'thousand yard stare' when they complain about a gooned up lever, say 'that's they best they get' or say they have to send the whole bike back.
Early failure of shimano 9s levers and some 10s, is not uncommon. To say that it is smacks of ignoring the facts and legitimizing their pisspoor design...but talking to those that work at shimano, ALL they do is correct...even things like SPD-R.
Qui Si Parla Campagnolo 25 March 2005 18:01:54 [ permanent link ]
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
It's extraordinarily rare that they fail "spontaneously." They're either DOA > when new (which, I'll agree, isn't acceptable, but at least it's spotted > before it leaves the shop) or they fail because a crash shoved the lever > against the handlebar, bending it outward a bit.
You must be kidding. They work for a while, less than the 3 year warranty, then one day, you can't shift to a smaller cog w/o holding the big lever outboard...no crashes. If that isn't 'spontaneous', then I don't know what is. Something in there breaks, and it doesn't work...simple
Mike Jacoubowsky 25 March 2005 21:24:43 [ permanent link ]
It's extraordinarily rare that they fail "spontaneously." They're either >> DOA when new (which, I'll agree, isn't acceptable, but at least it's >> spotted before it leaves the shop) or they fail because a crash shoved >> the lever against the handlebar, bending it outward a bit.>
You must be kidding. They work for a while, less than the 3 year warranty, > then one day, you can't shift to a smaller cog w/o holding the big lever > outboard...no crashes. If that isn't 'spontaneous', then I don't know what > is. Something in there breaks, and it doesn't work...simple
No, I'm not kidding. There is no question that many of the shifters wear out before they ought to, but if the fabled "spontaneous" failures occur so often, there'd be an awful lot of people complaining that they had a ruined ride because their shifter doesn't work (yeah, you & I know the secret of holding the big lever, but most don't). The truth, and truth is sometimes a tough thing to face, is that is rarely happens without warning. At some point it may completely fail, but there are warning signs before that (missed shifts once in a while). But these aren't "spontaneous" failures.
Obviously, your mileage may vary. Could be that we're catching anomalies on the shifters when new and replacing ones that otherwise might have failed (in the manner you described) down the road. As I said, we do catch a reasonable number of DOAs, perhaps more than most because we're rather picky about it.
"Qui Si Parla Campagnolo" <peter@vecchios.com> wrote in message news:1111759113.bf7117cc5267cae42a361848c8e40377@teranews...> Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>
It's extraordinarily rare that they fail "spontaneously." They're either >> DOA when new (which, I'll agree, isn't acceptable, but at least it's >> spotted before it leaves the shop) or they fail because a crash shoved >> the lever against the handlebar, bending it outward a bit.>
You must be kidding. They work for a while, less than the 3 year warranty, > then one day, you can't shift to a smaller cog w/o holding the big lever > outboard...no crashes. If that isn't 'spontaneous', then I don't know what > is. Something in there breaks, and it doesn't work...simple
Qui si parla Campagnolo 27 March 2005 19:02:21 [ permanent link ]
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:>>
It's extraordinarily rare that they fail "spontaneously." They're either >>>DOA when new (which, I'll agree, isn't acceptable, but at least it's >>>spotted before it leaves the shop) or they fail because a crash shoved >>>the lever against the handlebar, bending it outward a bit.>>
You must be kidding. They work for a while, less than the 3 year warranty, >>then one day, you can't shift to a smaller cog w/o holding the big lever >>outboard...no crashes. If that isn't 'spontaneous', then I don't know what >>is. Something in there breaks, and it doesn't work...simple >
I guess my point is that other than the crank/BB, few things of a group do so much work and cost so much. For these things to fail, whether they be spontaneous or not, shows a genuine arrogance on shimano's part to NOT make the design a better one. To have a STI lever fail in 3.5 years requiring a $200 repair is poor(IF you can find a single. No sigles yet for DA or ultegra 10s, and ultegra 9s cogsets, like 12-27, are now hard to find. A Sram 12-28 is a GREAT alternative).
Mike Jacoubowsky 28 March 2005 04:47:28 [ permanent link ]
It's extraordinarily rare that they fail "spontaneously." They're either >>>>DOA when new (which, I'll agree, isn't acceptable, but at least it's >>>>spotted before it leaves the shop) or they fail because a crash shoved >>>>the lever against the handlebar, bending it outward a bit.>>>
You must be kidding. They work for a while, less than the 3 year >>>warranty, then one day, you can't shift to a smaller cog w/o holding the >>>big lever outboard...no crashes. If that isn't 'spontaneous', then I >>>don't know what is. Something in there breaks, and it doesn't >>>work...simple>>
I guess my point is that other than the crank/BB, few things of a group do > so much work and cost so much. For these things to fail, whether they be > spontaneous or not, shows a genuine arrogance on shimano's part to NOT > make the design a better one. To have a STI lever fail in 3.5 years > requiring a $200 repair is poor(IF you can find a single. No sigles yet > for DA or ultegra 10s, and ultegra 9s cogsets, like 12-27, are now hard to > find. A Sram 12-28 is a GREAT alternative).
I agree 100%.
Happy Easter, by the way. Got in a nice ride this morning before church. Strange thing, darn few people out on the road. Cars or bikes. Would have thought people would have tried to get in a ride before family obligations and such.
