I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train only, no wheels.
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in their higher end groups. What do you think?
"Steve Sr." <Nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:6kpe41pffhhl0qa5h5cskdt10bvkh44fib@4ax.com...>I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train> only, no wheels.>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in> their higher end groups. What do you think?>
One "advantage" of DA over Ultegra, DA has 3 year warranty; ultegra is only 2 years. For STI shifters, I would get DA. Everything else ultegra.However, since DA 10 triple isn't out yet, you're out of luck as the current DA 10 STI levers are only double.
Also, since you're looking at triple, no DA 10 triple yet. When DA 10 triple does come out, the triple crank will have the same proprietary 92mm inner/granny chainring that DA 9 has and will be limited to one (1) chainring - 30t. For more versatility, get the ultegra triple crank, it has a 74mm inner/granny chainring that will allow you to substitute up to 24 or 26t chainring if you so desire.
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train> only, no wheels. >
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in> their higher end groups. What do you think?
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.
On 2005-03-27 22:21:00 -0800, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> said:
Steve Sr. wrote:>
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>> only, no wheels.>> Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.
"Steve Sr." <Nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:6kpe41pffhhl0qa5h5cskdt10bvkh44fib@4ax.com...>I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train> only, no wheels.>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in> their higher end groups. What do you think?
I assume that you are considering ultra high mileage otherwise reliability and durability issues don't really come into it. All their current range has both attributes although the high end stuff would probably eventually last longer. Why just Shimano? If durability and reliability is really a factor, Campagnolo stuff is renowned for its durability. I have a Victory derailleur and crank assembly on one of my bikes that is starting its eighteenth season. It still seems as good as new with approx 30000km on it -and the Victory group was the second cheapest in the range. I replaced the ball bearings in the B/B about four years ago and that was only because I was moving it onto another bike and had it stripped down. .
On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 00:21:00 -0600, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
Steve Sr. wrote:>
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>> only, no wheels. >>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.
Yea, right! Unfrotunately I have 2 other bikes with Shimano which my brain has successfully adapted to use. It would be forever confused with the Campy levers that work backwards and require your thumb!
On 2005-03-27 22:21:00 -0800, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> said:>
Steve Sr. wrote:>>
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>>> only, no wheels.>>> Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>>
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.>
To Dura Ace? Give me a fucking break.
Sorry, if you want it to break, you have to stick with Dura Ace.
Mark "ducking and running" Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
"Steve Sr." <Nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:6kpe41pffhhl0qa5h5cskdt10bvkh44fib@4ax.com...>I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train> only, no wheels.>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in> their higher end groups. What do you think?
My understanding between the differences is, pretty much where you see Ti on the Dura-Ace, you see alloy on the Ultegra. Where you see alloy on the Dura-Ace, you'll see plastic on the Ultegra.
Ultegra was updated, I believe in 2005. Some of the changes include outboard bearings on the bottom bracket, an integrated spindle, and more ergodynamic shifters (like the Dura-Ace). Prior to 2005, I don't believe they were 10-spd either. Just something to think about if you find a 2004 or earlier Ultegra bike on sale.
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>> only, no wheels.>> Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.
Can I get Shimano stickers to cover up the Campagnolo logos at no additional charge? ;)
-- Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
Steve Sr. wrote:> On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 00:21:00 -0600, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org>> wrote:>
Steve Sr. wrote:>>
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>>>real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>>>bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>>>only, no wheels. >>>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>>>that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>>>their higher end groups. What do you think?>>
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.>
Yea, right! Unfrotunately I have 2 other bikes with Shimano which> my brain has successfully adapted to use. It would be forever confused> with the Campy levers that work backwards and require your thumb!>
Steve>
Backwards -- have you ever used a Campy? I have both Shimano and Campy on my bikes and have no trouble. On both, shifting to a larger sprocket requires essentially the same hand movement. The only difference is in shifting to a smaller sprocket, but it is a minor difference. The Campy thumb lever is slightly more convenient, in my opinion, and has the advantage of guarding the computer buttons from unwanted presses.
Qui si parla Campagnolo 29 March 2005 18:05:12 [ permanent link ]
Rangersfan wrote:
My understanding between the differences is, pretty much where you see Ti on > the Dura-Ace, you see alloy on the Ultegra. Where you see alloy on the > Dura-Ace, you'll see plastic on the Ultegra.>
Ultegra was updated, I believe in 2005. Some of the changes include > outboard bearings on the bottom bracket, an integrated spindle, and more > ergodynamic shifters (like the Dura-Ace). Prior to 2005, I don't believe > they were 10-spd either. Just something to think about if you find a 2004 > or earlier Ultegra bike on sale. >
There is no 'ti' on DA 10s except for the largest 4 cogs. There was no Ti on DA 9s except for the freehub body and last 3 cogs.
On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 19:57:10 -0500, Steve Sr. <Nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 00:21:00 -0600, A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org>>wrote:>
Steve Sr. wrote:>>
I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>>> only, no wheels. >>>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>>
Chorus is superior in every way IMHO and cheaper too.>
Yea, right! Unfrotunately I have 2 other bikes with Shimano which>my brain has successfully adapted to use. It would be forever confused>with the Campy levers that work backwards and require your thumb!
Haven't we all evolved to the point of having an opposable thumb?
On 2005-03-28 16:39:42 -0800, "araby" <araby@rogers.com> said:
"Steve Sr." <Nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:6kpe41pffhhl0qa5h5cskdt10bvkh44fib@4ax.com...>> I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>> only, no wheels.>>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>
I assume that you are considering ultra high mileage otherwise > reliability and durability issues don't really come into it. All their > current range has both attributes although the high end stuff would > probably eventually last longer.> Why just Shimano? If durability and reliability is really a factor, > Campagnolo stuff is renowned for its durability. I have a Victory > derailleur and crank assembly on one of my bikes that is starting its > eighteenth season. It still seems as good as new with approx 30000km on > it -and the Victory group was the second cheapest in the range. I > replaced the ball bearings in the B/B about four years ago and that was > only because I was moving it onto another bike and had it stripped > down. .
You state "as good as new" and then note 30,000km. That's hardly anything. I regularly get 4 years, and about 40,000 miles, out of Dura-Ace stuff, changing only cassettes, chains, and brake pads. After 40,000 miles (60,000 km) I typically get a new group, as the shifters get a bit sloppy (not BAD, but not as good as new, and the chainrings are starting to get a little hooked, and the rear derailleur gets a bit worn as well, with the original pulleys). Done this 3 times over the past 12 years. And I don't change hubs at the same time... just ball bearings every 2 years or so.
I HAVE had problems with 105 parts -- the seals on the freehubs suck and fret the cones if you look at them crosseyed -- but Dura Ace is nothing if not durable. I do live in CA but I don't do much maintenance.
On 2005-03-28 17:55:25 -0800, "Rangersfan" <incoherent@NOSPAM.hotmail.com> said:
"Steve Sr." <Nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message > news:6kpe41pffhhl0qa5h5cskdt10bvkh44fib@4ax.com...>> I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any>> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little>> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train>> only, no wheels.>>
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know>> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in>> their higher end groups. What do you think?>
My understanding between the differences is, pretty much where you see > Ti on the Dura-Ace, you see alloy on the Ultegra. Where you see alloy > on the Dura-Ace, you'll see plastic on the Ultegra.
No. Ti on Dura-Ace would typically be steel on Ultegra. And Alloy->plastic... what?
Ultegra was updated, I believe in 2005. Some of the changes include > outboard bearings on the bottom bracket, an integrated spindle, and > more ergodynamic shifters (like the Dura-Ace). Prior to 2005, I don't > believe they were 10-spd either. Just something to think about if you > find a 2004 or earlier Ultegra bike on sale.
...> As for the crank, I think the ALUMINUM crank of either Chorus and > Record, at MUCH less $ than DA or ultegra, with a really simple, very > effective proven BB design is the way to go. SO MANY are swayed by the > outside of the BB bearing crank, which answerts no \question, solves no > problem with regard to the square taper BB/crank setup. PLEASE don't > claim it is stiffer...it is when tested by a gorilla machine that exerts > much more force than any human....
Peter,
Are you saying that Chalo Colina is not human?
-- Tom Sherman - Earth (Downstate Illinois, North of Forgottonia)
...>> As for the crank, I think the ALUMINUM crank of either Chorus and >> Record, at MUCH less $ than DA or ultegra, with a really simple, very >> effective proven BB design is the way to go. SO MANY are swayed by the >> outside of the BB bearing crank, which answerts no \question, solves no >> problem with regard to the square taper BB/crank setup. PLEASE don't >> claim it is stiffer...it is when tested by a gorilla machine that exerts >> much more force than any human....>
Peter,>
Are you saying that Chalo Colina is not human?
I think we've been intimating that for years... his size alone pretty much disqualifies him.
Ryan Cousineau 31 March 2005 19:18:32 [ permanent link ]
In article <jpvn41h9sm57mp5i7lnhbaaghkh22a72d8@4ax.com>, Mark Hickey <mark@habcycles.com> wrote:
Tom Sherman <tsherman@qconline.com> wrote:>
Peter Chisholm wrote:> >
...> >> As for the crank, I think the ALUMINUM crank of either Chorus and > >> Record, at MUCH less $ than DA or ultegra, with a really simple, very > >> effective proven BB design is the way to go. SO MANY are swayed by the > >> outside of the BB bearing crank, which answerts no \question, solves no > >> problem with regard to the square taper BB/crank setup. PLEASE don't > >> claim it is stiffer...it is when tested by a gorilla machine that exerts > >> much more force than any human....> >
Peter,> >
Are you saying that Chalo Colina is not human?>
I think we've been intimating that for years... his size alone pretty> much disqualifies him.
It's getting cold in here!
But...equipment which is designed for Chalo's size and power is likely to be overdesigned for the majority of cyclists. He's so big and strong that he (or possibly Shaquille O'Neal, who is known to have a really big custom mountain bike) personally may be the extreme limit of size and strength among serious cyclists.
Put more bluntly, there may be heavier cyclists than Chalo, but they're probably riding a lot less vigorously than him.
Below average, -- Ryan Cousineau, rcousine@sfu.ca http://www.wiredcola.com Verus de parvis; verus de magnis.
Qui si parla Campagnolo 1 April 2005 18:06:23 [ permanent link ]
Tom Sherman wrote:> Peter Chisholm wrote:>
...>> As for the crank, I think the ALUMINUM crank of either Chorus and >> Record, at MUCH less $ than DA or ultegra, with a really simple, very >> effective proven BB design is the way to go. SO MANY are swayed by the >> outside of the BB bearing crank, which answerts no \question, solves >> no problem with regard to the square taper BB/crank setup. PLEASE >> don't claim it is stiffer...it is when tested by a gorilla machine >> that exerts much more force than any human....>
Peter,>
Are you saying that Chalo Colina is not human?>
I'm saying that he is certainly at the fringe of the rider bell curve. I don't think amnufacturers should build to his example.
Steve Sr. wrote:> I am considering a component group for a new road bike. Are there any> real advantages for the Dura-Ace group over Ultegra except a little> bit of weight reduction? I am talking brakes and a triple drive train> only, no wheels. >
Is Dura-Ace more reliable / durable that the Ultegra group? I know> that Shimano sometimes uses better materials i.e. sealed bearings in> their higher end groups. What do you think?
Well, if you're really concerned with reliability and having a triple, there's Veloce, Centaur (Veloce with the new Centaur BB!), etc...
