"If you did manage to produce enough power, could you power through the bow wave and thus produce a shock wave?"
If you did, you would be on plane, traveling over the water for the most part, and leaving any remnant of a bow wave behind the boat. Any relation of this phenomena to a sonic or acoustical shock wave is only academic, since the speed of sound in water is about 5 times faster than air, so it isn't likely that there will ever be a watercraft moving at 3500mph.
Harry Krause 20 January 2006 17:59:18 [ permanent link ]
JimH wrote:> "Floyd" <Flooydomit@prodigy.net> wrote in message > news:qP6Af.1000$ur7.463@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...>> "If you did manage to produce enough power, could you power through the >> bow wave>> and thus produce a shock wave?">>
If you did, you would be on plane, traveling over the water for the most >> part, and leaving any remnant of a bow wave behind the boat. Any relation >> of this phenomena to a sonic or acoustical shock wave is only academic, >> since the speed of sound in water is about 5 times faster than air, so it >> isn't likely that there will ever be a watercraft moving at 3500mph.>>
I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at WOT once > while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant Tostito. >
JimH wrote:> I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at WOT once > while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant Tostito. >
tostito as in a giant corn based chip? how is that possible? was it carrying any added dip or guacamole?
"DownTime" <DownTime@SpammersMustDie.com> wrote in message news:eW6Af.9955$Zj7.6495@tornado.tampabay.rr.com...> JimH wrote:>> I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at WOT >> once while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant Tostito. >
tostito as in a giant corn based chip? how is that possible? was it > carrying any added dip or guacamole?
Yes........in 55 gallon drums strapped onto the deck.
Harry Krause 20 January 2006 18:07:06 [ permanent link ]
DownTime wrote:> JimH wrote:>> I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at WOT once >> while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant Tostito. >>
tostito as in a giant corn based chip? how is that possible? was it > carrying any added dip or guacamole?
Skipper is the added dip. I dunno about the guac, though.
JimH wrote:> "Floyd" <Flooydomit@prodigy.net> wrote in message > news:qP6Af.1000$ur7.463@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...>
"If you did manage to produce enough power, could you power through the >>bow wave>>and thus produce a shock wave?">>
If you did, you would be on plane, traveling over the water for the most >>part, and leaving any remnant of a bow wave behind the boat. Any relation >>of this phenomena to a sonic or acoustical shock wave is only academic, >>since the speed of sound in water is about 5 times faster than air, so it >>isn't likely that there will ever be a watercraft moving at 3500mph.>>
I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at WOT once > while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant Tostito. >
Shortwave Sportfishing 20 January 2006 19:58:18 [ permanent link ]
On 20 Jan 2006 06:11:41 -0800, "dbohara@mindspring.com" <dbohara@mindspring.com> wrote:
I have been wondering if a displacement hull that moves fast enough>would create a sort of "sonic boom" just as an object moving fast>enough in air does. In air, the shock is created when the aircraft>moves too fast for the air to get out of the way. In water, a>displacement hull attempts to climb its bow wave which effectively>limits its speed. Apparently, this hull speed is not a mathematical>limit but merely a practical limit as sufficient power can move a hull>over hull speed. However the power necessary to produce any further>increase in speed radically increases above hull speed. If you did>manage to produce enough power, could you power through the bow wave>and thus produce a shock wave?
you are not traveling through water, but on top of it - thus, no.
if you are traveling through water, then yes provided that you can provide the hydrodyamic vessel with sufficient power to boost it past 3500 mph because sound travels five to six time faster in water than air.
"Floyd" <Flooydomit@prodigy.net> wrote in message >> news:qP6Af.1000$ur7.463@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...>>
"If you did manage to produce enough power, could you power through >>> the bow wave>>> and thus produce a shock wave?">>>
If you did, you would be on plane, traveling over the water for the >>> most part, and leaving any remnant of a bow wave behind the boat. >>> Any relation of this phenomena to a sonic or acoustical shock wave is >>> only academic, since the speed of sound in water is about 5 times >>> faster than air, so it isn't likely that there will ever be a >>> watercraft moving at 3500mph.>>>
I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at WOT >> once while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant Tostito. >
Maynard G . Krebbs 21 January 2006 05:23:19 [ permanent link ]
On 20 Jan 2006 06:11:41 -0800, "dbohara@mindspring.com" <dbohara@mindspring.com> wrote:
I have been wondering if a displacement hull that moves fast enough>would create a sort of "sonic boom" just as an object moving fast>enough in air does. In air, the shock is created when the aircraft>moves too fast for the air to get out of the way. In water, a>displacement hull attempts to climb its bow wave which effectively>limits its speed. Apparently, this hull speed is not a mathematical>limit but merely a practical limit as sufficient power can move a hull>over hull speed. However the power necessary to produce any further>increase in speed radically increases above hull speed. If you did>manage to produce enough power, could you power through the bow wave>and thus produce a shock wave?
I don't believe a displacement hull could produce a sonic boom. When you push a displacement hull past it's hull speed it doesn't plane, it starts to roll/wallow. More than likely it would just roll over and sink. Mark E. williams
"Floyd" <Flooydomit@prodigy.net> wrote in message >>> news:qP6Af.1000$ur7.463@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...>>>
"If you did manage to produce enough power, could you power through >>>> the bow wave>>>> and thus produce a shock wave?">>>>
If you did, you would be on plane, traveling over the water for the >>>> most part, and leaving any remnant of a bow wave behind the boat. >>>> Any relation of this phenomena to a sonic or acoustical shock wave >>>> is only academic, since the speed of sound in water is about 5 times >>>> faster than air, so it isn't likely that there will ever be a >>>> watercraft moving at 3500mph.>>>>
I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at >>> WOT once while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant >>> Tostito. >>
Skipper *is* a giant Tostito!>
Come on, Don. I know you can do better than that!>
On Fri, 20 Jan 2006 08:49:51 -0800, markvictor wrote:
3721 mph, but that would be in a submarine, not on the surface, at sea> level, the nasa standard table puts SOS at sea level in daytime at> 761mph...so that is what a surface vessel would have to achieve to break> the sound barrier; even a displacement hull is still floating on the> surface of th water, so it wold be subject to gas physics.A boat on the> surface is exerting a fixed force on the water (in a perfect world),> this force remains more or less constant, varying onle due to lift and> loss of it while moving, this will not generate a fast enough shock wave> through water to cause a "sonic boom"
The eventuality of a "sonic boom" underwater may not be that far off. The Russian supercavitation torpedo, the Shkval, has a speed of 350 km/h, and was operational in the '70s. The German Barracuda being developed is expected to reach 800 km/h. Supercavitation may be old technology. With magnetohydrodynamic torpedoes, speeds of 1700 mph may have already been reached.
Shortwave Sportfishing 22 January 2006 15:24:27 [ permanent link ]
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 05:27:53 -0500, thunder <thunderTAKEOUT@gti.net> wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jan 2006 08:49:51 -0800, markvictor wrote:>
3721 mph, but that would be in a submarine, not on the surface, at sea>> level, the nasa standard table puts SOS at sea level in daytime at>> 761mph...so that is what a surface vessel would have to achieve to break>> the sound barrier; even a displacement hull is still floating on the>> surface of th water, so it wold be subject to gas physics.A boat on the>> surface is exerting a fixed force on the water (in a perfect world),>> this force remains more or less constant, varying onle due to lift and>> loss of it while moving, this will not generate a fast enough shock wave>> through water to cause a "sonic boom">
The eventuality of a "sonic boom" underwater may not be that far off. The>Russian supercavitation torpedo, the Shkval, has a speed of 350 km/h, and>was operational in the '70s. The German Barracuda being developed is>expected to reach 800 km/h. Supercavitation may be old technology. With>magnetohydrodynamic torpedoes, speeds of 1700 mph may have already been>reached. >
On Sun, 22 Jan 2006 12:24:27 +0000, Shortwave Sportfishing wrote:
tell the truth thunder - you live in your mothers basement and surf the> web all day right?>
just joking....
Well, I don't live in my Mother's basement, but I do seem to spend more time on this box than I should. I'd never thought of a "sonic boom" underwater, until reading this thread. It did remind me of the Shkval, and . . . it's truly amazing the technology we use to kill each other.
It may be old news to you, but I did come across this in my readings. One has to wonder.
"Floyd" <Flooydomit@prodigy.net> wrote in message >>>> news:qP6Af.1000$ur7.463@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...>>>>
"If you did manage to produce enough power, could you power through >>>>> the bow wave>>>>> and thus produce a shock wave?">>>>>
If you did, you would be on plane, traveling over the water for the >>>>> most part, and leaving any remnant of a bow wave behind the boat. >>>>> Any relation of this phenomena to a sonic or acoustical shock wave >>>>> is only academic, since the speed of sound in water is about 5 >>>>> times faster than air, so it isn't likely that there will ever be a >>>>> watercraft moving at 3500mph.>>>>>
I believe Skipper claimed his Bayliner came close to that speed at >>>> WOT once while on the Sea of Cortez trying to outrun a giant >>>> Tostito. >>>
Skipper *is* a giant Tostito!>>
Come on, Don. I know you can do better than that!>>
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